*** Stephen Russell - Petition & Poll ***

Dia on 30/4/2013 at 03:50

You're far from being 'late to the party', Taffer. Why, it's only just begun! ;)

I thoroughly agree that EM should've tried to spin their refusal to use SR differently, but in truth I doubt that no matter how they might have phrased it, there would have been a general uproar by many Thief fans. However, I rather doubt that EM is trying to jump on the SR bandwagon; they've stated their reasons (dubious as though they may sound to some of us) for not hiring (re-hiring?) SR, and have gone to lengths to emphasize their stand on this. More like certain unofficial representatives of EM (forums) have wished us well with the petition and that was all. I think at this point, if EM addresses the issue again (which I get the feeling they don't see as an issue in the first place), it will only be to reiterate the soundness of their decision to go with another actor and that will pretty much be that. I don't believe they have any hidden agendas: in fact the only agenda they seem to have is to make a game to rival DX:HR in popularity, and of course, sales figures. I'm afraid HR's success may have gone to their collective heads. *insert the 'my opinion only' disclaimer*

I agree with Renz (& anyone else who's stated this) that T4 will either end up being a great game, or a miserable, epic failure - and not anywhere in between. The recent news of just how much turmoil has gone on behind the scenes within the T4 dev team is not reassuring in the least, but goes far towards explaining why there was no word about T4's development for so very long. As recently as this past year certain observant Taffers were remarking on the fact that EM had 'help wanted' ads online for T4; I guess in hindsight that was our first clue that perhaps all was not well, right? Once again, we'll have to wait & see.

But you're welcome to join the party, sir. Have a seat and wait with the rest of us while this story continues to unfold. It should prove to be quite interesting.

Or not.

:cheeky:

Chade on 30/4/2013 at 05:08

Quote Posted by arandomgamer02

I continue to marvel at how TTLG continues to thrive to this day ... Okay, now to thiefessa ... You are deliberately trying to put yourself on a pedestal, rile up the public by saying controversial things (especially in here!)

A thriving community should be capable of tolerating dissent from the group norms. This should be doubly true of a site dedicated to the memory of a company like LGS.

There is nothing wrong with saying controversial things, and I would like to think that the members here are capable of choosing for themselves who they want to listen and respond to.

jtr7 on 30/4/2013 at 05:23

He was being kind. I'm certain "controversial" wasn't the right word to use. The intolerance toward several members' controversial statements for defending LGS and Thief is closer to the truth of how the majority at TTLG view things. You are correct that a memorial site with a 14-year-old fanbase should be more tolerant, but the intolerance of LGS and their games and their fans is the "norm", here. We've practiced segregation for half the age of this site.

Chade on 30/4/2013 at 05:53

I disagree with almost every single damn thing you just said, but that's beside the point. I'm not talking about all that historical crap. I'm talking about what is happening right here and now, where thiefessa is currently a clear minority on this board and is being hounded for it.

When you jump in here and disagree with everyone, there's nothing wrong with everyone arguing right back at you. I just hope everyone agrees that people with minority views have every bit as much right to come here and join in as anyone else, regardless of how much other people will like hearing what they have to say.

antihero276 on 30/4/2013 at 05:55

Quote Posted by Brethren

"Nostalgia" - they make it sound like some kind of gimmick. All the while ignoring the fact SR is still perfectly capable of handling the role he essentially created, unlike Sean Connery who's like 85 years old now. :p

"It's a nice thought." How insulting, demeaning, and condescending that little quote is. I wonder if they even realize it. I can just picture them giving all the diehard Thief fans a little dismissive pat on the head.

Grrr... that thought went through my head as well... makes me feel like puking. :eww: treating us like children too young to form an opinion on something.

jtr7 on 30/4/2013 at 06:01

It would be interesting to see an alternate timeline where the fans had never petitioned for DromEd I, II, or T3Ed. If LGS had never hung out with TTLG'rs here and on IRC#. Would Eidos-Montreal exist? Would they be working on another Thief game? The fans did help shape the games. I wasn't one of them until after LGS had been shut down, but one can see the banter going on for years. Just the Q&A's Digi had with LGS employees were major.

thiefessa on 30/4/2013 at 12:47

Quote Posted by arandomgamer02

Okay, now to thiefessa. Thiefessa, you are being absolutely over the top. It's crystal clear that you are here purely on assignment from Eidos, despite what you may say to the contrary (and, that's what I believe). You are deliberately trying to put yourself on a pedestal, rile up the public by saying controversial things (especially in here!), posting every four or five posts ALL THE TIME, and then trying to mask it underneath smiley faces. Now you will no doubt respond to this in some fashion and try to get into a long protracted conversation with me, try to poke little holes in what I have typed and run around in circles, to which I respond: THIS IS THE INTERNET. I am not writing my comps, it's not perfect. I will engage back with you to a point, assuming you respond to this, but not excessively like you will attempt.

Well, you are certainly free to believe what you like.... but none of what you say makes any sense. Not one post of mine (when read in context) displays any attempt to put myself on a pedestal or rile up the public, as you suggest. Neither do I poke holes or run around in circles, as you put it, when I respond to a post such as yours... quite the contrary, I am straight to the point, just as in this post.

If you are going to throw out your personal opinion of me (which is something I never asked for, and isn't even really what this forum is all about) it would be realistic to expect a reply and you should be willing to debate intelligently and finish what you started. It would help if you actually back up your reasoning with logic, proof and motive when answering my questions. Why do you think I'm on some sort of assignment from Eidos? Why would I need or want to put myself on any kind of pedestal? What pedestal are you even talking about? What do I gain from that? etc etc and, secondly, why do you believe my personal opinions rile up the public? Your argument implies I am the only Thief fan who has a certain point of view. People come to forums every day and discuss/debate/argue their points of view... they don't have to all agree with each other. It isn't some sort of sinful act if you're in a different flock, or just standing alone. I don't get riled up if someone expresses a different view to mine - so why would you?
Let's discuss via PM so we don't bore people here.

EDIT: I thank those who have expressed support. I have now asked the mods here to bring an end to these kinds of posts.
We would all surely much prefer to talk about the game - not someone's personal opinion of me.

Dia on 30/4/2013 at 13:47

Quote Posted by Chade

I agree. And, like in any community, there's bound to be disagreements and arguments. That's just human nature. You have a point in that we should be allowed to choose whose posts we read and respond to. Though there are forum rules and regs, frankly I'm glad the Mods & Admins here grant us such latitude that we're able to voice our opinions as passionately as we do. Trying to stifle every person who disagrees with you or doesn't like you (or whom you don't like) is not what these forums are about (and yes, I admit I've lost my self control in the past; mea culpa and lesson learned). But when it gets to the point that the name-calling begins, rather than continue with retaliation against real or imagined slights/insults, rather than deluge our ever-busy Mods & Admins with complaints and demands that they ban so-and-so or censor so-and-so, I've found that the 'Ignore' feature works very well as an alternative. What you can't see/hear/read won't offend. Unfortunately, just like in any other forum, TTLG has its share of trolls and spammers; but as I said before, the Ignore feature works great in those instances. :thumb:

I'd really hate to see these forums go the way of some others that are at opposite ends of the extreme to TTLG: A.) so heavily censored that practically no arguments or dissent are allowed, period - only happy-happy-joy-joy posts allowed there; or B.) so totally out-of-control that the forum resembles a war zone where you enter at your own risk and post in fear of having your skin flamed off your very bones. We have something very special here in TTLG.

And yeah, jtr; I think EM would've come into existence regardless of whether or not TTLG ever existed (i.e. DX). But I wholeheartedly agree that fans really do help shape the games. Unfortunately, we die-hard Thief fans are in the minority and it's the general majority who will win out regarding influencing the way any game is made nowadays. *sad face*

CloudOJD on 30/4/2013 at 13:50

Quote Posted by Dia

You do have a valid point, Cloud. However, it's not just our opinion because even though EM never came right out and stated it, they did offer little snippets like (quotes taken from the RPS article - (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/04/03/thief-voice-actor-2/):) 'Politely and understandably don't explicitly state' .... inferring that EM didn't want to come right out & insult SR - claiming his age to be a factor in their decision, so chose to be more tactful in giving their reasons for not hiring him.

Well, our opinion was formed from the information they gave us, that's what I meant. We wouldn't be thinking this if they didn't say these things.

Quote Posted by thiefessa

This is pretty much how every one of your posts sound like in this thread.

The reason why everyone is calling you out on this is because you support every single thing Eidos says and claims about the whole situation, in such a way that basically screams "I'm on their side.", and you insult our intelligence by going all "Oh, what could possibly give you that idea?"

Let me guess, what I just said doesn't make any sense and/or is just my personal opinion?

thiefessa on 30/4/2013 at 14:29

Quote Posted by CloudOJD

The reason why everyone is calling you out on this is because you support every single thing Eidos says and claims about the whole situation, in such a way that basically screams "I'm on their side.", and you insult our intelligence by going all "Oh, what could possibly give you that idea?"

"Everyone"? Hardly. :cheeky:

So the reason for your behaviour, according to you, is because "I support every single thing EM says and claims about the whole situation".
Are you talking about third-party articles? If so, then, yes, I would rather believe official info over non-official. I explained my reasons earlier and, no, I didn't say anything like "Oh, what could possibly give you that idea", so you insult your own intelligence. I said that this is a general view I hold regarding ALL things one reads out there. I take everything with a pinch of salt until I am presented with the absolute facts. I also explained that this doesn't mean there might not be some inkling of truth here and there, but not to the point that the game is cancelled etc or that just because a member of staff is said to have 'left', doesn't mean he/she 'quit' etc etc.... that kind of thing.

So, yeah, my viewpoint on third-party articles has always been the same and, actually, its a very rational and normal response not to believe every little thing one reads. Or, at least, I thought that was the case. Again, I realise we're all different. But I don't call you out for believing everything you read; that's really up to you. I don't care one way or the other... and neither should you care that I have an opposite view to yours on these matters.

As requested earlier, can we take this to PM? I am very happy to discuss further.