A Question about the OM "Eavesdropping".

Brother_Murus on 9/10/2009 at 09:56

And also, I was wondering if you ever get to see (In-game) Lord Bafford. I was also wondering if it IS possible to kill your sparring partner in the training mission of TDP.

Jah on 9/10/2009 at 10:14

Lord Bafford appears in the TG mission Song of The Caverns, hanging out on a balcony with his favorite opera singer (or ballerina, or whatever she is).

jtr7 on 9/10/2009 at 10:53

As far as we are ever told, we never see Bafford in-game. Unnamed characters have been chosen here and there by fans to be him, but nothing says any of them are Baffy.

Jah on 9/10/2009 at 11:20

There's a note addressed to one of the singers where a "Lord B." asks to meet her on the balcony to give her a gift, and the lord on the balcony with the girl is carrying a necklace or amulet or somesuch. Perhaps we don't know for 100% certain that Lord B. is Bafford, but I'd say it's a pretty reasonable conclusion.

PotatoGuy on 9/10/2009 at 13:53

I think it would be better if we say he isn't ol' Baffy. It may be cooler to never see him - he's the guy you always rob but never see. :D

jtr7 on 9/10/2009 at 21:26

Quote Posted by Jah

Pretty good! Too bad he looks just like two others in the game, both in the company of women, but the balcony is a connection. Also, too bad they are only bad-mouthing the playwright Mr. Cribs. Nice job, and thank you!

(Sigh) So much I haven't gotten around to yet. :(

:cheeky:

Stath MIA on 11/10/2009 at 22:29

Actually, it's impossible for him to be Bafford owing to him being in attendance at Karras party in LOTP, if it was the Lord Bafford on the balcony, then there is a chance that he could already be dead by the time of his later appearance (after all, the games have to allow for all possible outcomes [They marked Ramirez as "no response" in LOTP just in case you killed him before]).

Jah on 12/10/2009 at 08:59

What about the Hammerite high priest you need to rescue in T1 in Strange Bedfellows? If he's supposed to be the same high priest from whom you stole the Holy Hammer in Undercover, you could have killed him, too.

As far as Ramirez is concerned, we know that he's dead in TDS, so his absence from Angelwatch doesn't necessarily have anything to do with what the player did with him in T1.

Stath MIA on 12/10/2009 at 23:01

Quote Posted by Jah

Another open-ended situation, it could be the same one but if you killed him in Undercover then it is impossible for it to be him. I'd assume that he is a different high priest, I'd gamble that there are probably quite a few high priests in charge of various hammer facilities throughout the city and that they just transferred another one in to replace the dead guy.

Quote:

As far as Ramirez is concerned, we know that he's dead in TDS, so his absence from Angelwatch doesn't necessarily have anything to do with what the player did with him in T1.

Not necessarily, but quite possibly. That's the beauty of open-ended gameplay, Ramirez is dead, we don't know why, but we do know that it happened. Thief 2 says nothing to suggest that he is alive, in fact it drops hints that he isn't, and DS confirms that he died, though not when or how it happened. Too me, this seems to implies that Ramirez died sometime between Assassins and LOTP, no matter the player's actions.

Every character you actually encounter in-game is assumed dead for future levels, this includes Lt. Moseley; she's not in charge in DS even though she is the logical next in command, she is no longer around because the player might have killed her after she dropped off her letter in Courier. If it was Bafford on that balcony, then he could not have attended Karras party just on the off-chance that the player had chosen to be psychotic mass-murderer Garrett on that level.

jtr7 on 13/10/2009 at 00:10

I do like these kinds of debates, they make me consider or reconsider or even discover things.:thumb:

I had an inkling, so I went to check. In Undercover there are two Priests, one pacing about in his upper basement room (with the inverted red hammer sigil), and the sleeping Inquisitor in the dungeons.

Cross-checking with Strange Bedfellows, there are three Priests. One is in the sealed room below with the Hammers, where Garrett gets his objectives to find the High Priest--and then they go kill an Apebeast. One is in the first sub-level the player reaches under the Altar, face-down dead in a puddle of blood. And then, there's the "Hostage Priest", the High Priest who will save the day with his mighty Builder's Chisel!

So, there's no telling, but there's lots of room for individual fan-fiction. Thanks guys!