Hoodwink on 28/10/2001 at 19:08
It's ok as a sneaker, but much like Thief 2, DX just isn't any good for strafe & jump combat. The movement in the world is slow, and it seems like stuff just doesn't interact right. This has been my main bitch with both games, but especially DX. I hear DX2 might use the Quake 3 or Half-Life engine. Is this true? It really would make it more playable, as far as giving one a choice between styles of play. I bought Unreal Gold recently, and frankly, it sucks ass. I can see where the ugly physics in DX come from.
Let the discussion begin <img src="smile.gif" border="0">
J
lunatic96 on 28/10/2001 at 19:31
Just out of curiosity, where exactly do you get your information?<br /> <img src="tongue.gif" border="0"> <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0"> <img src="confused.gif" border="0"> <img src="confused.gif" border="0"> <img src="graemlins/eww.gif" border="0" alt="[Eww...]" /> <img src="graemlins/sly.gif" border="0" alt="[Sly]" /> <img src="graemlins/weird.gif" border="0" alt="[Weird]" /> <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">
X on 28/10/2001 at 19:34
It will use the Unreal II engine, therefore the physics should be exemplerary. The physics in the original were adequate if not overly realistic. They did not impinge on the gameplay however, as the world was, as overly documented, stunningly coherant.
Hoodwink on 28/10/2001 at 23:17
Lunatic: I believe I read it on PlanetDeusEx, but I could be mistaken. I haven't looked it up in a while, so maybe I'm a little dated.
I have never played Unreal II, so I don't know what the physics are like. My main complaint is simply that I don't know when I'm close enough to stun a bad guy without alerting him to my presence. Also, while the story and textures were emersive, certain things about how the world reacted to things just pissed me off. Much like in Unreal gold, running badguys don't really look like they're part of the world they are running in. I dunno, I just find it nearly impossible to do anything other than snipe the badguys, since once they know I am there, they do some freaky strafe-facingthewrongdirection-moonwalking thing that makes it tough for me to track them.
BTW, how come even on easy level with low tech maxed and sneaking up on guys, it takes more than one hit with the stun gun to take them? That seems a little wrong to me. Maybe that's what I get for using cheats <img src="graemlins/eww.gif" border="0" alt="[Eww...]" />
PS THAT'S IT!!!!!
Their legs move faster than they do. IN Half-Life, the soldiers legs look like they are syched to their land speed, where as in DX (and Theif), they look like kids running on linoleum with socks. You think they will fix that?
[ October 28, 2001: Message edited by: Hoodwink ]</p>
Agent Monkeysee on 28/10/2001 at 23:21
Quote:
Originally posted by Hoodwink:<br /><strong>I have never played Unreal II, so I don't know what the physics are like.</strong><hr></blockquote>
That's not surprising as Unreal II isn't out yet. DX2, T3, and, I think, Unreal II will all use the Unreal Warfare engine, which is the next incarnation of the unreal series of engines. This engine is still in development.
Hoodwink on 29/10/2001 at 09:32
Quote:
Originally posted by Agent Monkeysee:<br /><strong>
That's not surprising as Unreal II isn't out yet. DX2, T3, and, I think, Unreal II will all use the Unreal Warfare engine, which is the next incarnation of the unreal series of engines. This engine is still in development.</strong><hr></blockquote>
<br />Is this a good thing then? I don't know what the UT engine is like either, although I have heard that it's what DX is based on. Why can't they just go with Quake or something? I would love to go totally DM on everyone, but the engine makes it tough. Or is it just me? The only experience I have with the Unreal engines (outside T2 and DX) is Unreal gold, and I wished I had spent the $10 on DX (I play with a copy, although I will buy 2 when it come out). It just doesn't lend itself well to anything other than a sneaker, IMHO.
ZenAbraAgain on 29/10/2001 at 19:09
I understand and appreciate your complaints about the feel of the movement, but I think your focus on the engine is a little off.
The movement in DX was programmed to be distinctly different from anything in Unreal, Unreal Tournament or any other previous Unreal license. The movement was designed by Ion Storm for DX. They didn't just install and use the base code from UT. If you really knew UT and DX, you would appreciate how completely different the feel and movement can be in different games using the Unreal engine.
Having explained that, the same would occur if they used the Quake3, Lithtech or Half Life engines. The movement would be unique to the game as the designers intended. As far as physics and movement design, an engine simply provides a code base and code structure as well as a set of tools (and limitations) with which to build. A Deus Ex or Thief game using the Q3 engine would feel nothing like Q3A. And it shouldn't.
Thief and Deus Ex are less sports and more stories. Deathmatch-based multiplayer games are a new form of sports. Thief and Deus Ex are a new form of storytelling. We're talking two completely different genres that should and do have completely different feels.
rhalibus on 29/10/2001 at 21:57
What's interesting is that Epic is including a new ultra-precise physics code in its latest engine. The new code is called the MathEngine and I'm not sure if Deus Ex will use it but it'll be cool if the new code is integrated within the DX universe...
Agent Monkeysee on 30/10/2001 at 07:26
Quote:
Originally posted by Hoodwink:<br /><strong>
<br />Is this a good thing then? I don't know what the UT engine is like either, although I have heard that it's what DX is based on. Why can't they just go with Quake or something?</strong><hr></blockquote>
<br />It's not based on the UT engine, both UT and DX use some version of the 400 series of the Unreal Engine, although it's often referred to as the UT engine because it's prolly the most popular game using it and its easier to distinguish between the "Unreal Engine" and the "UT Engine" than it is to say "Unreal Engine vs. the 400 series Unreal Engine". Like ZenAbrAgain mentioned, the feel of the game is more up to the individual designers than the engine they end up using.
And yes! Using the Unreal Warfare engine is definitely a good thing! The few previews we've seen show it to be pretty impressive.
Hoodwink on 30/10/2001 at 10:55
I do hope it's better. I don't know if I had mentioned it yet, but the physics of the game are the only real problem I had with it. When I first played it (around February or March, maybe?), it was after about 3 or 4 attempts to get used to the controls. Once I did, I think I spent every spare moment (ok, I was on unemployment, so just about every moment <img src="smile.gif" border="0"> ) on the game, since the story and the world was so immersive. Playing it a second time, I can't get that much enjoyment out of it, since I know what is coming up next, pretty much, and I also am too worried about following too closely to my last path, or missing some important element entirely. I have done a few things different (not killed so many people, except MJ12), and I have seen a few little things I missed last time, but I can't imagine that there is a lot that I missed the first time. I spent HOURS trying to make sure I missed nothing, and actually used a walkthrough that listed only the aug canisters, to make sure I got to play with them all. I can't imagine a whole lot more replays from it, since it is too time intensive to play over and over (I can knock out Half-Life in a day or two, even on difficult). I do await every sequel (and fan packs, if available), with great eagerness.
