"The Trickster's Loot Locator" - loot tool for Thief1/ThiefGold/Thief2

Queue on 18/2/2010 at 17:54

Not to degrade your work in anyway, but I was just thinking...

But where is the fun in using tools or cracking open Dromed to find all the loot, or secrets and hidden places of a mission? I know it's frustrating, but it's supposed to be--that's the whole reward is to finally find what you're looking for, or discover something you didn't realize was there.

Isn't it?

I'm wondering about this because of the mission I'm working on. Would players rather enjoy discovery, or just find all the loot?

Namdrol on 18/2/2010 at 17:59

Discovery every time.

Queue on 18/2/2010 at 17:59

...even if it may frustrate the living hell out of you?

lost_soul on 18/2/2010 at 20:01

What if it could cause all loot to make some sort of sound when the player is near it? Sure, it would be a massive immersion breaker, but it may be easier to setup/use. Just a thought.

intruder on 18/2/2010 at 20:55

I don't think many people would like this idea. Just think about TDS: most people (including myself) complained about this "flashing" of loot to make it easier to spot.
In my opinion it would be better if (more) authors would place hints in the form of diary / journal entries pointing towards well hidden loot, especially for those "the diamond on the wooden beam in the library beneath the ceiling"-locations :D

gnartsch on 18/2/2010 at 21:21

Quote Posted by Queue

Hi Queue,

I absolutely get your point. Nevertheless, when I go for loot and have thouroughly searched every place 3 times already (and spent 2 hours just to find virtually nothing while hunting for the rest), but still even don't have an idea where the hell to check even more thouroughly I ABSOLUTELY go nuts. I MUST KNOW how mean the author can be to hide the rest of the loot in a place SO HARD to find.
Regarding the joy of discovery : you are absolutely right about this.
Personally I never use any tools / lootlist etc. before I have fully explored entire the mission and have spent some considerable time to figure out each aspect of the mission on my own.
Using tools should be the VERY last resort indeed.
I could not imagine anything more boring than having a loolist/walkthrough ready, start playing and check off the tasks/items on that list while playing :bored:

Namdrol on 18/2/2010 at 21:39

Quote Posted by Queue

...even if it may frustrate the living hell out of you?

As long as I get enough to meet the objective I'm normally happy but and I like to find every secret and all bonus objectives.
If it's a good engaging mission I'll hunt and search though.
I like it when a mission is designed so those hard to find pieces and secrets force you to discover something like a special area etc.

I see gnartsch's point, sort of. The only time I tried to get The Lazy Taffer to work was when beta testing Tribal Breeze by Ticky/scarykitties, there was just so much loot missing and I went through that fm with a fine tooth comb.
(btw if you haven't played this yet why not? It has such a :eek: moment halfway through. Great mission)

gnartsch on 18/2/2010 at 23:54

Regarding on what players want to see in a mission:
it is definitely discovery & interesting plot and turns in the story line.
As far as loot is concerned : well, we take everything as long as it is for 'free' :cheeky:
However, I feel like stupid if I find less than 95% of loot and tend to believe having not found exactly one of those interesting spots you want us to discover.

So, if you plan to have some really hard hidden loot/secret in the mission, how about letting us have a glimps at it through a crack in the wall or something ?
Like that we would know it is in THIS place and not on the other side of the planet.

jiansonz on 19/2/2010 at 01:08

Well, I tried out the Loot Locator on Lord Alan´s Basement, and I am happy to say that it helped me find two items I had missed, and also to realize that there is 40 loot that probably can´t be grabbed.

(Yes, I want to use this tool only when I feel like I have been everywhere three times over and really combed the place. The Lord Alan´s Basement save was, like, 6+ hours into the mission...)

The map is a weird thing to understand. I tend to use unique loot pieces or loot combos I know where they are, and try to orient myself from there.

Going for The Search for Crom´s Blade now. I missed 260 loot there, and I now know that it´s probably a gold nugget and eight scattered coins (of which I´ve found two already, thanks to TTLL). But I need to go to bed now, so I´ll hunt more later.

Queue on 19/2/2010 at 03:33

Quote Posted by gnartsch

...So, if you plan to have some really hard hidden loot/secret in the mission, how about letting us have a glimps at it through a crack in the wall or something ?
Like that we would know it is in THIS place and not on the other side of the planet.

Nah. Once again, where's the fun in that. :ebil:

This is the underlying problem with many fan-missions, they are simply not devious enough in game play or structure. Or, that they are devious in the sense of being utterly unrealistic (why in the hell would a hidden switch be up where someone would have to stack boxes to get to it, anyway?) Loot and secrets should be well hidden, but not put into impossible situations.

For me, the trick is to hide things right out in the open--and to force the player to have to think about his next move instead of running around like an idiot looking for treasure.