Scholar on 23/7/2006 at 02:30
Hello all,
I'm new to the forums though I've played through the Thief series, I'm replaying Thief 1 and I have a plot question, in St. Yora's which clearly must have been the dormitory there's a journal in which someone (the novice who saw Murus' ghost and was wondering about why his holy symbol didn't work perhaps?) mentions knowing why Murus can't rest, why he requires a conscecration ceremony and being too weak to reveal this to the higher ups for fear of their anger, is their any text elsewhere which sheds light on this matter.
Thanks
metal dawn on 23/7/2006 at 02:38
Murus died before the fall of the Cathedral if I remember correctly.
Some legends say ghosts can see into all parts of time (past, present, future).
Maybe Murus saw the coming attack and was try to send a warning.
An alternate explaination might be that he suspected or knew the Eye was evil (or would bring evil) and refused to rest in order to watch over Cathedral and --if I may venture further-- ensure that the artifact left the Cathedral.
Lady Taffer on 24/7/2006 at 01:32
. . .and I always thought it was because he had some passionate liason with one of the younger acolytes and that's why they thought he needed the ritual of consecration, or something. . .:sweat:
Holywhippet on 24/7/2006 at 04:03
The impression I have is that it has to do with the sunburst device you find. As you may know from Thief 2: the Hammerites are not supposed to develop new technology. They are only supposed to use that which the Builder gave them. The sunburst device breaks that rule which has caused those who developed it to be unable to go to the afterlife. Murus either helped with the device or did not reveal knowledge of the device which has caused his unrest.
I think some of the documents in that mission support this theory.
RavynousHunter on 24/7/2006 at 05:53
speaking of which... did the sunburst device ever actually serve a purpose? :confused: aside from that, i just thought Murus was either a guardian or was being held there by the eye as some form of sick entertainment for the eye. :erg:
Jarkko Ranta on 24/7/2006 at 06:04
Murus could be explaned as most undead in the Cathedral ('cept he's not evil, just annoying and only apparition who tries to kill Garrett with impossible quests, not ghost shots). If haunts were dead Hammerites who were summoned from the dead by the Eye (I mean not died in the Cataclysm but before it) then it's ok to Murus been dead before it. All scrolls in the mission support this. Maybe Murus is a kind of True Hammerite of bygone days (didn't actively try to control the Eyes, as written by Smith-in-Exile). Also, the Eye's wavs tell that Murus has fought against the Eye all the decades after the Cataclysm. Maybe other Brothers failed (but this won't explain why Renault and Martello won't shumble as zombies... crap)
Solabusca on 24/7/2006 at 08:01
Quote Posted by Holywhippet
As you may know from Thief 2: the Hammerites are not supposed to develop new technology. They are only supposed to use that which the Builder gave them.
Hogwash. I'm certain the builder didn't give them steam-powered factories, sewer systems, electrical power and the like.
Hammerites have very specific
guidelines about how they're supposed to advance, not outright bans on advances. Otherwise, why would they have Karras develop Garret's mechanical eye?
.j.
themetalian on 24/7/2006 at 13:34
Quote Posted by Lady Taffer
. . .and I always thought it was because he had some passionate liason with one of the younger acolytes and that's why they thought he needed the ritual of consecration, or something. . .:sweat:
I smell an FM. :joke:
Lord Dalar on 24/7/2006 at 18:22
Actually I think that blessing Murus' holy symbol might give a glimpse of what happened, do you connect?
I think the hammerite writing the second "book" last quoted knows that the responsable for the blessing of the symbol to perform the ritual hasn't done his work well, maybe he has a part in this, and so the consecration ritual wasn't accomplished.
Concerning Murus and Martello, well maybe they had a "relationship" who really knows...
I always thought murus wasn't a "smart guy" actually I imagined him very silly in life for not saying stupid, or morelike: Funny, he is the brother everyone loves because he actually can't get it if not for mistake...well that's what my impressions were as i played that mission, the truth is only in our interpretations, for an ever silent bell hangs on to the top of the Cathedral...
Holywhippet on 26/7/2006 at 00:31
Quote Posted by Solabusca
Hogwash. I'm certain the builder didn't give them steam-powered factories, sewer systems, electrical power and the like.
Hammerites have very specific
guidelines about how they're supposed to advance, not outright bans on advances. Otherwise, why would they have Karras develop Garret's mechanical eye?
.j.
Did you sleep through all of Thief 2? After the events of the original game, the Hammerite order was divided. Some of them felt that the whupping the Trickster gave them proves they are on the wrong path. They felt that only by developing new technology could they ensure such a thing would not happen again. Karras led the defection of many Hammerites to form the Mechanist order. Free of the Hammerite restriction on developing new technology they developed Garrett's new mechanical eye.
Yes, the technology they got from the Builder is an odd mix of "old" and "modern". My mnain explanation is that this are just games and the developers felt that atmosphere was more important than logic and realism. Think about it, who is the Builder? A God? A man? Is he still alive or dead? The game provides no details so its hard to say exactly what he did to found the order.
