Cigam on 26/11/2013 at 09:47
Did someone working on Thief 2 decide that 14 missions was not enough so they would pointlessly make you retread through the same mansion twice?
Why? I mean why? Is there a mod to remove it but let you start Masks with the loot you had prior to Casing?
R Soul on 26/11/2013 at 15:27
I can't be sure about their reasoning, but I remember reading that the story was made to fit the missions and LGS were pressed for time. Eidos might have insisted on a certain number of missions, but that's just an idea of mine; I have no evidence.
When I played I also thought it was awful, especially because I didn't like ghosting. At least Ambush and Courier had a few missions between them. Skipping isn't as simple as it would be for any other mission. The goals for Masks a partly dependent on the optional goals you do or don't complete in Casing. Not impossible mind you, but not the work of a moment.
Ombrenuit on 26/11/2013 at 21:05
I don't mind "Casing." Instead of thinking of it as 2 levels just think of it as one big mission in two parts. If you really hate it I believe it can be speedrun in 5 minutes or less.
Cigam on 26/11/2013 at 23:33
But it isn't one big mission. If you want sufficient loot for Masks you have to search through every room for loot, plus scrolls and books if you are interested in reading more of the story, flip levers to open doors and discover secrets and switch off security.
Then if you want sufficient loot for Soulforge you have to retread through every room you have just searched through already. Not to mention check for new scrolls and books and flip the same levers.
It is almost like playing Bafford's Manor, completing it then starting mission 2 and it is Bafford's Manor again. And if you want the loot for Cragscleft you have to pretty much repeat what you have just completed doing. This would not be one mission in two parts it would be playing the same mission again.
A truly bizarre decision.
jtbalogh on 27/11/2013 at 05:21
Quote Posted by Cigam
Is there a mod to remove it but let you start Masks with the loot you had prior to Casing?
When in Casing the Joint, press ctrl+alt+shift+end to complete and skip to Masks. I seem to be able to keep what I have. RSoul mentioned something about objectives changing so consider that effect.
SlyFoxx on 27/11/2013 at 19:09
You can always add extra cash when starting a new mission.
Put this line in your user config and save
Cash_bonus 1000
Yandros on 28/11/2013 at 17:19
I may be remembering wrong, but I believe Thief 2 Gold intended to put a mission between the two. I imagine that was LGS' plan all along, but the schedule (or the lack of progress on that mission) forced them to remove that mission from the initial T2 release, and then of course T2G never happened so we're left with the missions back-to-back.
Blastfrog on 29/11/2013 at 03:55
Thief 1 is equally guilty (if not more) of reusing level architecture in later missions. Still, at least they made whole new missions of it. Such a shame TMA Gold never came to be, it could have been amazing.
retractingblinds on 30/11/2013 at 01:26
Quote Posted by Blastfrog
Thief 1 is equally guilty (if not more) of reusing level architecture in later missions. Still, at least they made whole new missions of it. Such a shame TMA Gold never came to be, it could have been amazing.
Escape and Return to the cathedral? Those are pretty significantly different missions than the previous ones that take place in the same location. I'd hardly call that equally guilty. The added areas in them are pretty major shifts at that.
Muzman on 30/11/2013 at 07:23
Casing the Joint/Masks is something everyone hates and will never understand why. It really seems to demonstrate that gamers are just poking buttons on some Skinner box to get a reward. They're not really involved in any way, they just want to get to the end, get new things etc. Quite sad. Plus it's also a really cool map and visiting it twice is fine.
The name ought to tell you what's going on anyway. I can guess how they came up with it: there were a lot of complaints of how hard it is to go into a level blind in Thief. So they thought let's design in some thiefy behaviour in a the mission structure. There's a big event, you've got some intel so you go in before the big event and get used to the place so can deal with it better during the big event. Boom. Makes perfect sense.
Gamers, bereft of imagination, hate this because "it's the same map twice and I want new things wahhh".
So, I don't get it.
It's a great level I love running around in, a real adventurous piece of structuring from the designers and actually seems exactly like something Garrett would do. Take control of the situation rather than just blundering from one thing to the next. One of the few story beats in Thief 2 that does seem exactly like it should be there actually.
