CLANG - sword fencing controller for more than "quick attack" and "strong attack" - by Beleg Cúthalion
catbarf on 13/6/2012 at 04:38
Quote Posted by Phatose
It won't work very well, the same reason it hasn't worked well on the wii or the move.
There isn't a way to create resistance to movement at appropriate times. You swing at the enemy, he blocks - your in game sword stops. Your arm doesn't. Same on parries. Same on successful hits too.
Given that a sword fighting game is pretty much all about those things, you've got a theoretically accurate controller that is constantly out of sync with whats going on in the game.
The best solution I can think of for this is to have the sword be knocked back when parried, producing a small delay before it immediately moves to the current position of the controller. But yeah, it's a real problem.
Sg3 on 13/6/2012 at 06:15
The only proper solution is an expensive one: a powered exoskeleton "reversed." So when your virtual arm is stopped by punching the wall or hitting his sword, your real arm is stopped by the powered exoskeleton.
Beleg Cúthalion on 13/6/2012 at 08:08
Quote Posted by catbarf
The best solution I can think of for this is to have the sword be knocked back when parried, producing a small delay before it immediately moves to the current position of the controller. But yeah, it's a real problem.
The thing is that this system is only historical for 19th century sabre fencing (or late 16th century German rapier). According to the fencing treatises, (German) sword fencing till the early 16th century took place mostly from the bind, so you react to the pressure your opponent gives you instead of simply parrying and riposting (or, god forbid, trying to cut through a parry with even more strength). Not a single movie I know employs these techniques, that's why it's not surprising that non-HEMAs still think of medieval fencing as this sort of Hollywood steel threshing. (Note that the techniques in the CLANG videos look more like Italian longsword which involves more grappling AFAIK; Guy Windsor being involved sort of confirms this.)
Mount & Blade is by the way a bit similar to the sword fighting implementation of Thief 1/2, but despite being intuitive and probably the best solution until now, it isn't historical either.
DDL on 13/6/2012 at 11:28
I would've thought the main problem with this whole concept is that the majority of gamers are not athletic swordsmen just waiting to test their mettle against a worthy opponent, they're just...people. People who have zero experience of swordfighting.
Christ, give me a two-handed sword and I'd be hard pressed to come up with anything more sophisticated than "pointy bit toward enemy?"
The whole point of the escapism in gaming is to "let you be things you're not", rather than "allow your avatar to be every bit as fucking cack-handed as you are".
Unless they make the enemy AI fucking godawful at swordfighting too, this is probably only going to appeal to a very niche market. Like, even more niche than those fucking "hardcore tactical shooters" that spend millions of processor cycles calculating super-accurate barrel rifling and shit.
SubJeff on 13/6/2012 at 11:34
Quote Posted by Sg3
The only proper solution is
to have a proper sword fight.
The other failure with this is footwork. Its half the skill and you won't have it with current tech, and by that I mean flat screen tvs.
Thirith on 13/6/2012 at 11:56
Quote Posted by DDL
The whole point of the escapism in gaming is to "let you be things you're not", rather than "allow your avatar to be every bit as fucking cack-handed as you are".
The way I could imagine this to work is basically in analogy to
Guitar Hero/
Rock Band. They don't simulate actually playing the instruments (unless we're talking about
RB's Pro Mode, or about drums/singing, which are reasonably close to the real thing), but they're great at imitating the feel of playing in a band. Playing them is somewhere in between playing real instruments and the more abstract pressing of buttons that comes with a controller or with KB+M.
Beleg Cúthalion on 13/6/2012 at 14:01
I also doubt that this is going to produce something unplayable. If it's done correctly (whatever that means), people will strive to become better, just like they became better in sneaking through stealth games.
DDL on 13/6/2012 at 14:49
Just like playing jedi academy made me better at strangling people with my mind?
..I'm not sure that's how this works, dude.
Pemptus on 13/6/2012 at 15:41
Quote Posted by Beleg Cúthalion
I also doubt that this is going to produce something unplayable. If it's done correctly (whatever that means), people will strive to become better, just like they became better in sneaking through stealth games.
I'm pretty sure you don't have to crouch and walk softly around your computer to play stealth games.
Beleg Cúthalion on 13/6/2012 at 21:35
When I think of Assassin's Creed walking around would indeed be easier than using keyboard and mouse. Seriously, are you really imagining this as a game without an adequate learning curve? It's not like people went mental when they had the chance to fly a plane on the computer using a joystick similar to a pilot's. :weird:
