Brian The Dog on 11/9/2010 at 14:02
Quote Posted by Renzatic
Wise man. Just get a little $1000 limit starter card and use it to buy games online. That's the only reason I can think of beyond the business I'd need a credit card for. Everything else? Cash. Instantaneous payment on bills, no interest, and you always know exactly where it's going.
While I agree that cash is best, how would you pay for things like electricity, gas, telephone, etc? They still accept cheques here in the UK, but they are being phased out over the next 15 years (although personally I'll believe it when I see it - it's still the best way of sending money to someone).
I only have my credit card to (a) buy things online, as you get added protection here in the UK if it's a credit card, and (b) for buying things abroad (although this is less of an issue now that we're moving debit cards away from Maestro/Switch to Visa/Mastercard which is accepted all over the world). Debit card or cash for everything else.
Queue on 11/9/2010 at 14:11
Quote Posted by Fafhrd
Fuck Chase. I'd had Washington Mutual for years and loved them as a bank. But ever since Chase acquired them and promised that nothing would change with my bank service, there are tons of little annoying things that have started to crop up (I have to BUY my checks now? Two dollar ATM surcharge for using a non-Chase ATM, on top of the 1.50 THAT ATM charged me? The fuck?). Fuck Chase. I'd change banks in a heartbeat if I could find one that had the same services as WaMu (the big ones being free checking without requiring direct deposit, free checks, and no ATM surcharges), and it weren't going to be such a fucking hassle to move my savings.
We've been loyal Chase customers for years (our local branch started out as National Bank of Detroit, then Bank One, then Chase) and have recently changed banks because of the underhanded bullshit that Chase is now calling policy--especially with ATM and credit cards.
Honestly, though, I can't think of any bank that offers free checking, or free services of any kind for that matter, now. They've become cash hungry and willing to fuck the customer in any way possible to obtain that cash--especially after all the governmental bailouts.
CCCToad on 11/9/2010 at 15:12
Quote Posted by Renzatic
Wise man. Just get a little $1000 limit starter card and use it to buy games online. That's the only reason I can think of beyond the business I'd need a credit card for. Everything else? Cash. Instantaneous payment on bills, no interest, and you always know exactly where it's going.
I'd recommend even lower: a $500 limit. Its very rare that anyone in the middle class is going to spend close to that much on any given day, and for major purchases you can always call them up and have the limit temporarily raised
Brian The Dog on 11/9/2010 at 15:12
Most banks here in the UK are free (even to remove cash from each other's ATMs), but I guess they don't operate in the US. How about Santander or HSBC? They are the two enormous banks here, they might have a presence in the US.
demagogue on 11/9/2010 at 21:00
I remember my friend visiting me here in DC and she wanted to go to Chase to deposit some money and there's not a *single* bank in the entire region... We had to go online to find a place and the nearest one is fricken Delaware! That's like 2 hours away. What kind of major international bank doesn't have a single branch bank in the capital or like 10 states on the east coast? Just adding to the Chase hate.
zombe on 11/9/2010 at 21:38
Just adding to the credit card hate ... credit cards ... ugh :eww:
I resisted getting myself a credit card for years. It is significantly less secure than cash sticking out of your back pocket and functionally completely and utterly useless - with the one and only exception: buy stuff from anywhere else over the internet.
For comparison: if i buy or otherwise move money in internet transactions locally - it goes like this:
* log in to bank (ie cut the potential malice of the other party out of the process), for that:
* ... use your chosen username and ...
* ... authenticate yourself using ID-card (using the non-copyable physical object itself + authentication code).
* do the transaction (pre-filled form from data given by the other party) by signing it (using the ID-card again + authorization/signing code)
+ other security measures to make bank site spoofing very hard (generally impossible).
Most significant difference: _I_ am the one who will do the transaction VS giving some unknown dude over the internet the right to do whatever transactions they want ... and whenever they want ... and as many times as they want ... and leak that right to anyone accidentally or on purpose.
In short, for someone to do any unauthorized transactions they will need from me: physical object + 3 private codes.
VS credit card: freely copyable and reusable public data about my credit card, no physical object nor any private codes needed. => WTF!? (Actually, at least one of our local banks offers virtual credit-cards that are usable only once in internet - therefore offering reasonable protection. BUT NOT MY @#%& BANK !)
For non-internet use: the usual bank-card (card itself, most likely not copyable + private code). Non-internet part is strict - you can not use it for anything in internet. + other non-cash means.
I'm sure something similar is possible elsewhere too - so why is the current non-secure credit-card usage nonsense still mandatory !?
D'Juhn Keep on 11/9/2010 at 21:48
Quote Posted by Brian The Dog
(although personally I'll believe it when I see it - it's still the best way of sending money to someone).
Cheques are pretty awful for retailers, hence them not being accepted in many places and will rightly be phased out. I don't know about other banks/building societies but with Nationwide any account holder can transfer money instantly to any other account holder. This should eventually be extended to transferring money to any other bank. There's no actual reason for the ridiculous BACS charges at the moment so they will go at some point.
Brian The Dog on 13/9/2010 at 12:02
You're right of course, but cheques do still have their uses - it's more secure than internet banking, and you don't need the person's bank account number to send them money. People like my parents refuse to have anything to do with internet banking, so they send cheques whenever they want to send money to people. Although I do agree that paying by cheques at shops is not needed now - your cheque guarantee card duals as the debit card, so why not just use the debit card?
Edit - Zombe, I'm not sure I understood your post. Aren't internet transactions via https that are digitally signed and use TLS encryption? I don't think it's compulsory, but I wouldn't buy anything from a shop online without it going through a digitally signed server.
Queue on 13/9/2010 at 14:13
After finally getting rid of my credit cards, I use a debit card for all "on-site" purchases, but prefer to still use actual checks (and the old fashion system of sticking a stamp on a envelope and popping it in the post) for all my bills. In my mind, there is a tangible paper trail when using checks, and something you can fall back on if there are any disputes--unlike strictly electronic transactions.
Plus there are purchases that I simply wouldn't want on a credit card, due to their size. An example of this will be tomorrow when my summertime property taxes are due. It's going to be over $1000.00. Would you want to charge a thousand bucks to a card, then pay interest on that or worry about paying it off later (along with all the other purchases you made during the billing period) to avoid said interest? Instead, just write a check and be done with it.
Brian The Dog on 13/9/2010 at 15:12
Sometimes, a purchase that large will get bounced by the credit card company. I had my Laptop for ~$500 held by HSBC as it was by far the biggest thing I purchased last year on it.
