demagogue on 18/3/2009 at 08:35
Looks a little like a big red, squashed eyeball on her head to me.
But then I'm the last one to be qualified to say! :joke:
Holy Thief on 18/3/2009 at 10:38
demagogue :thumb:
It is possible that women may have only been accepted as nurses in the Hammerite order. If we are to accept the Hammerites were loosely based upon the Templars, who were forbidden to associate themselves with women. It is written in Templar rules that when wounded they could only be treated by one of their own and with this in mind if one of them was so severly wounded that he required hospitalization I could see there being women to help nurse the 'Hammerite' back to health but then again you don't have to be a woman to nurse the wounded. However on the other hand Hospitallers had women members as their main duty was to tend to the ill and injured pilgrims.
We need more Hammerites!
RavynousHunter on 19/3/2009 at 02:38
Methinks a woman's primary role in the Order would be to do tasks deemed unbefitting a Brother, which would free up said Brothers' time and energy on more important tasks, such as smiting heretics, cleric duties, and the various industries they work in.
Holy Thief on 19/3/2009 at 12:03
Indeed that is a possibility but on the other hand why bother with women, a celibate Order would need no use of them when a man can still be cook, cleaner and nurse as it was in the segregated monastic life, there would be different positions and vocations that would be equaly achieved within the Order (a master cook could still be called upon to bash a few Pagans).
I would not accept the concept of women as nuns or priestesses. :nono:
Queue on 19/3/2009 at 14:56
Whoa! She's hot...
I wouldn't think the Hammerites would have nuns, seems more of a "manly" order--running around with big hammers, whacking those hammers all the time, building stuff, you know.
What?!
JonesCrusher on 19/3/2009 at 19:42
No....No women in the Hammers...crikey they would fear the temptation for one thing....and they know flesh is weak...hehe.....come on! they are men after all.
If you put a writhing naked woman in front of any man....well,even the strongest would fall....and some men dont even need a woman to be writhing ....or naked either...I know from experience...Tee hee
I dont think I would be a nun in the hammerite order...maybe mechanist,they seem to have a good crack,between the sexes,from conversations I have heard(Excuse the pun)
Myth on 19/3/2009 at 20:05
Good question. There are female guards and more importantly, female priests amongst the Mechanists. And since it was not mentioned anywhere that they have broken traditional Hammerite dogma by accepting females as priests (remember they used to shoot cog-shaped projectiles) than it's safe to assume that there are female priests amongst the Hammers as well.
jtr7 on 19/3/2009 at 20:27
The sudden appearance of females of all ranks all over the place is a strong implication of breaking tradition. Since many scriptures were being rewritten, and the Hammers just called Karras and the Mechanist Order heretical and accursed, the differences were on display and weren't addressed individually. The main points that were made was that Karras placed himself at or above the Builder, and denounced the hammer as inferior to boiler and gear, both of which are blasphemous and everything else is relatively less sinful.
However the Hammers view women, they don't live with them, don't speak of them within the Order as more than devout, pious, and and service-attending, but never Sister So-and-so, Mother So-and-so, and no use of any terminology to suggest women are more than church-goers.
It would be easier to suggest they run hospitals and such.
But the biggest clue that could've been an argument for women in the Hammerite Order (though I think it has to more to do with the early days of the Mechanists as they began to splinter and changes were being swiftly made), is the female Mechanist asking...
mc40605A -- UNUSED: "Hast thou been back to our...old haunts, Friend?"
mc20605B -- UNUSED: "The Temple of the Hammer? Nay. Not since I joined with Karras."
mc40605C -- UNUSED: "Yestereve I visited to speak to mine...once-brothers. It struck my eye how...bare and shabby wert the rooms."
mc20605D -- UNUSED: "I do remember--now thou dost mention--they sought only to punish and threaten...and it gained them naught but fear. Karras seeks the friendship of the rich, blessing them with the works of his invention, and in return they do gift us well."
mc40605E -- UNUSED: "I must approve. For it makes mine surroundings much...more...fair."
mc20605F -- UNUSED: "If our 'old' brothers suffer that so many have left for our order, 'tis but their own fault for standing in opposition to progress."
We can't say why it wasn't used in the game, but one could make the assumption it was because the Hammers had no women Hammers. Assumption. Or there were, and we never took Garrett into a convent.
Petike the Taffer on 20/3/2009 at 00:50
I started the whole topic as utter speculation. I severely doubt there are any blatantly visible nuns among the Hammerites, but as several people have mentioned - it wouldn't be entirely out of the question, especially if they served the roles of nurses, housemaids or charity workers. Sounds reasonable, given all the pre-Reformation Western Medieval Christianity allegory crammed into the Hammers. I could hardly imagine the armour-clad fellows allowing the girls to man the machinery in their parish factories, though. :p
But I would still like to know what did Ziemanskye mean by putting that lady in the "Hammerite retirement home" from his older FM...
jtr7 on 20/3/2009 at 01:02
Quote Posted by Petike the Taffer
I started the whole topic as utter speculation.
You certainly did, and we're looking at the canon for convenient loopholes to support the idea.:p Hospitals, caretakers, uniform sewing, food-raising... The women raise food and the children, and the men raise structures and raze the unworthy structures. "Twas a time when their halls would be filled with novices...
And since FMs aren't part of the "Thief series", but are inspired by it, you'll need to talk to the FM crowd about those unbridled crazy fun FM concepts. :joke::joke::joke:
