The Magpie on 13/3/2008 at 12:41
Quote Posted by jtr7
I could write a scenario that's completely goofball, though.
I wouldn't think it could become much more goofball than the final showdown boss fight concept itself. Bring it.
Personally, I think Karras & Garrett would decide the victor by arm-wrestling.
Seriously for a moment, I... uh... no. I did have a serious point, but it seems to have evaporated in the face of silliness.
OK, now I remember: The anti-boss fight has been a staple of FPS game design at least since Quake. That's a tradition to uphold, too. Even if it's ridiculous.
--
Larris
R Soul on 13/3/2008 at 13:37
It is upheld. The three games end with Garrett versus the boss, it's just that the methods are different.
electricchild on 13/3/2008 at 23:08
Everyone, thank you for this great feedback I do think that this is an important topic to be discussing for future Thief games.
jtr7 on 14/3/2008 at 00:25
Garrett is electrocuted as Karras flips a switch on one of his many control panels.Garrett hears the familiar whimpering of a Masked Servant stepping out onto the roof. It is carrying a large bundle of vines--sections hacked off of Viktoria's final sacrifice. It scatters them around the rooftop. Garrett tries to sprint past the Servant, but the exit is blocked by Masked Mechanists with maces. The only escape is to jump off the roof. But it's too late...the rust-gas is already flowing from the Servant's lips. One ghostly touch and the chain-reaction will not cease until all organic matter is consumed. The chimney-effect of hot air rising into the night, and cold air spilling down the steps, quickly fills the stairwell with mutoxic vapors and all die a painful, horrifying death.Garrett senses a presence behind him. Good thing Garrett is blended with the shadows, or he'd be dead. He turns just enough to see that Karras has left his protective chamber, and he's hefting a golden mace.
"Karras" Garrett says, straightening up.
So... Garrett thinks to himself,
he finally figured out what I was up to. This should be interesting. I've never gone up against a mad genius before. He hardly seems fit enough to carry that mace, let alone use it."Yeeesss. Thou art the
vilest of
weeds, Garrett. Even more vile than that
loathsome Pagan
witch, who hath
defiled the Builder's house with her
foul and
unholy vines!" He swings the mace in a downward stroke as if swatting an invisible tangle of vines from his path.
"Not as foul as...
genocide."
"Hah! The Builder doth smile on Karras, for it is
he who bringeth the greatest glory unto The Builder. He hath
chosen me, His most
dutiful servant, to bring His
Paradise to the world. Karras shalt take his rightful place...at The Builder's...
right hand!" On the final words, Karras raises the mace, two-handed, above his head and charges. But stumbles, as if struck suddenly blind. His momentum carries him forward, and he's caught in the stomach by the lever at the base of the Signal Tower. The mace clangs horribly against the tower's supports, and Karras crumbles.
"Dewdrop hates Mechanists." The gentle voice of the young pagan child Lily reaches out from the hazy cloud of light zipping around. It disperses like a bubble that has popped.
"Huh. How'd that doll get into my pack? I know it wasn't part of my inventory."
"The
witch...liveth
still?" Karras pulls himself up onto his knees, rubbing his eyes. "Builder help me! Thy servant hath fallen at the hands of thine accursed enemies! Forsaketh me not, O Master Builder! Karras shalt not--!"
Garrett pulls out his sword and backstabs the gratingly mad Mechanist. "For Lily, and Lotus, and Viktoria." He throws the body down the stairs, back inside Soulforge. He moves the body nearer to Viktoria's remnant, and fires moss arrows at the Mechanist to defile the corpse further. The silvery blood causes the moss to wilt and die. Garrett works his way back to the protective chamber and finds it unlocked. After spending a few moments getting oriented, he calls the Servants back to Soulforge. While awaiting their arrival, Garrett determines how to cause the release of the Necrotic Mutox. Once the Servants have arrived, Garrett sets a rigged timer in motion, and leaves Soulforge, sealing the doors.
After reentering Soulforge with Artemus, to look upon the silent red-coated hollowness of the Cathedral...and after they speak of the prophecies and how they have been fulfilled to the letter...and after other Keepers have joined them to observe and record (and deal with any magical and mysterious artifacts lying in the dust)...there is a brief scare when an enraged Apparition enters the sanctuary, screaming backwards Paganese with a lisp, and casting skull-shaped projectiles that explode in a shower of dandelion seeds.
Quote:
Everyone, thank you for this great feedback I do think that this is an important topic to be discussing for future Thief games.
In what way? What are you thoughts?
Yandros on 14/3/2008 at 02:05
Quote Posted by jtr7
Garrett senses a presence behind him.
...
projectiles that explode in a shower of dandelion seeds.
I laughed, I cried, I hurled.
OK, well I laughed till I cried... That was a work of art. :thumb:
jtr7 on 14/3/2008 at 02:08
\o/
Thanks! I tried, hahaha....
electricchild on 14/3/2008 at 18:57
Quote Posted by jtr7
Garrett is electrocuted as Karras flips a switch on one of his many control panels.Garrett hears the familiar whimpering of a Masked Servant stepping out onto the roof. It is carrying a large bundle of vines--sections hacked off of Viktoria's final sacrifice. It scatters them around the rooftop. Garrett tries to sprint past the Servant, but the exit is blocked by Masked Mechanists with maces. The only escape is to jump off the roof. But it's too late...the rust-gas is already flowing from the Servant's lips. One ghostly touch and the chain-reaction will not cease until all organic matter is consumed. The chimney-effect of hot air rising into the night, and cold air spilling down the steps, quickly fills the stairwell with mutoxic vapors and all die a painful, horrifying death.Garrett senses a presence behind him. Good thing Garrett is blended with the shadows, or he'd be dead. He turns just enough to see that Karras has left his protective chamber, and he's hefting a golden mace.
"Karras" Garrett says, straightening up.
So... Garrett thinks to himself,
he finally figured out what I was up to. This should be interesting. I've never gone up against a mad genius before. He hardly seems fit enough to carry that mace, let alone use it."Yeeesss. Thou art the
vilest of
weeds, Garrett. Even more vile than that
loathsome Pagan
witch, who hath
defiled the Builder's house with her
foul and
unholy vines!" He swings the mace in a downward stroke as if swatting an invisible tangle of vines from his path.
"Not as foul as...
genocide."
"Hah! The Builder doth smile on Karras, for it is
he who bringeth the greatest glory unto The Builder. He hath
chosen me, His most
dutiful servant, to bring His
Paradise to the world. Karras shalt take his rightful place...at The Builder's...
right hand!" On the final words, Karras raises the mace, two-handed, above his head and charges. But stumbles, as if struck suddenly blind. His momentum carries him forward, and he's caught in the stomach by the lever at the base of the Signal Tower. The mace clangs horribly against the tower's supports, and Karras crumbles.
"Dewdrop hates Mechanists." The gentle voice of the young pagan child Lily reaches out from the hazy cloud of light zipping around. It disperses like a bubble that has popped.
"Huh. How'd that doll get into my pack? I know it wasn't part of my inventory."
"The
witch...liveth
still?" Karras pulls himself up onto his knees, rubbing his eyes. "Builder help me! Thy servant hath fallen at the hands of thine accursed enemies! Forsaketh me not, O Master Builder! Karras shalt not--!"
Garrett pulls out his sword and backstabs the gratingly mad Mechanist. "For Lily, and Lotus, and Viktoria." He throws the body down the stairs, back inside Soulforge. He moves the body nearer to Viktoria's remnant, and fires moss arrows at the Mechanist to defile the corpse further. The silvery blood causes the moss to wilt and die. Garrett works his way back to the protective chamber and finds it unlocked. After spending a few moments getting oriented, he calls the Servants back to Soulforge. While awaiting their arrival, Garrett determines how to cause the release of the Necrotic Mutox. Once the Servants have arrived, Garrett sets a rigged timer in motion, and leaves Soulforge, sealing the doors.
After reentering Soulforge with Artemus, to look upon the silent red-coated hollowness of the Cathedral...and after they speak of the prophecies and how they have been fulfilled to the letter...and after other Keepers have joined them to observe and record (and deal with any magical and mysterious artifacts lying in the dust)...there is a brief scare when an enraged Apparition enters the sanctuary, screaming backwards Paganese with a lisp, and casting skull-shaped projectiles that explode in a shower of dandelion seeds.
In what way? What are you thoughts?
WOW excellent story. As for your question I meant to say that the idea of having confrontations with primary antagonists might be a good feature to incorporate into future Thief games when they come out. You had somewhat of a confrontation with Constantine so Thief 1 did it somewhat right, but the rest don't give you that sense of satisfaction when you get to see the antagonist die before you.
jtr7 on 15/3/2008 at 23:44
I hope you are NOT suggesting that one Thiefy element be removed, one after the other, until we are left with a hugely successful and popular game, that holds little resemblance to the original recipe. TDS went too far with its compromises to appeal to a broader audience. Many ambitious and risky decisions went into TDP, and so many chances were taken. Like Garrett, LGS rebelled against the industry Faction and did what no one else could do. And like Garrett, the world never new or appreciated what amazing feat was accomplished. Since then, several games have borrowed from Thief, and few ever got those elements right.
Thief 4 will have to take risks, and be filled with radical ideas that go against the mainstream thinking of the industry and the mass market. That's gotta be in the souls of everyone involved. Ambitious concepts, not technical gimmicks or bells and whistles. The Thief games are a niche-market game, not a mass-market game. If it's made with a full-acceptance of that fact, maybe we won't see a dilution or anymore compromising of a proven recipe. It needs to break some industry rules and respectfully thumb its nose at the shallow mainstream.
Yandros on 16/3/2008 at 01:39
Hear hear! :cheeky:
Beleg Cúthalion on 16/3/2008 at 17:12
Since we're already far away from topic: To keep some kind of balance and to avoid too much where-are-the-Keepers problems, I think Thief IV should be more politicy-based (Digital Nightfall would probably agree like he did before) and focused on normal houses like TMA was. Plus - and now refering to the end boss issue - it would be really interesting to have no clear enemy. Instead of tracking down one person or group, Garrett would have to play factions off against each other to get profit from, but still with the tension of a real boss fight.
