GORT on 4/7/2015 at 10:40
Just like gigagooga said. It just needed to be cleaned up a bit. No problems on my end either.:thumb:
ZylonBane on 4/7/2015 at 12:42
Quote Posted by LarryG
DromEd uses a CSG (constructive solid geometry) approach to modeling, and converting that to 3ds will result in a LOT of garbage that you have to clean up in order to get a valid 3ds model. A WHOLE LOT.
Err, wr_export_obj doesn't export CSG brushes, it just exports the final worldrep resulting from the CSG operations (hence the "wr" in the command's name). There is nothing inherently "garbage"-producing about CSG-- many professional modeling programs use it. If anything, the problem with CSG here is DromEd, since it isn't a professional 3D modeling program, and so probably doesn't produce optimal meshes from its CSG operations.
That being said, it seems one would definitely want to optimize before exporting the worldrep. I'm guessing Niborius did NOT optimize before exporting, which is why that castle has so many polygon splits. Or maybe he did and that's just the best DromEd can do with that sort of geometry.
Niborius on 4/7/2015 at 16:55
I believe I did optimize it, but perhaps I portalized it later after a minor adjustment. Does that get totally rid of the previous optimization?
PinkDot on 4/7/2015 at 17:14
To get the cleanest results, you probably won't to surround your geometry-to-be-exported by a 'Me-only' area brush, so you don't get splits coming from surrounding geometries.
That castle tower model looks actually more like what you're used to see, when you get rid of all the internal triangulation of polygons - something that Dromed does not (thankfully) displays.
But yeah - there's a profound difference in the way objects are/should be modeled and the way Dromed splits the world into cells, which always have to be convex shapes. Engine doesn't mind that messiness, but for a human it's impossible to work with.
Quote:
Does that get totally rid of the previous optimization?
Yes, it does. Compare results before and after optimization having polygons displayed in Dromed - (ALT-8, ALT-9 or ALT-0, IIRC)
Quote:
There is nothing inherently "garbage"-producing about CSG-- many professional modeling programs use it.
In fact, boolean operations were always problematic in 3d packages. At least those operating on polygons - since it messes the topology (almost impossible to keep quads). The voxel based sculpting software probably handles it better these days with features like dyna-mesh and auto-retopology.
LarryG on 4/7/2015 at 18:41
Quote Posted by ZylonBane
Err, wr_export_obj doesn't export CSG brushes, it just exports the final worldrep resulting from the CSG operations (hence the "wr" in the command's name). There is nothing inherently "garbage"-producing about CSG-- many professional modeling programs use it. If anything, the problem with CSG here is DromEd, since it isn't a professional 3D modeling program, and so probably doesn't produce optimal meshes from its CSG operations.
That being said, it seems one would definitely want to optimize before exporting the worldrep. I'm guessing Niborius did NOT optimize before exporting, which is why that castle has so many polygon splits. Or maybe he did and that's just the best DromEd can do with that sort of geometry.
Yes. It doesn't export CSG, that's obvious. The .3ds file format is not a CGS file format.
And yes, CSG modeling in a professional CAD tool can result in a highly accurate mesh. But DromEd isn't that and never was intended to be that. And an exported worldrep from DromEd does have LOTS of garbage from a mesh modeling standpoint.
My point remains: modeling in DromEd and exporting to a .3ds file will always result in a suboptimal mesh when compared with building the same object's mesh in a 3d modeling tool intended for that use. Given that it is harder to model in DromEd, export it, clean it up, re-texture it, and then generate a valid .bin than it is just to model it in a tool specifically designed for that purpose, why would you ever do that, especially since the end result is very likely to be a much lower quality model when you are all done with your labors?
ZylonBane on 4/7/2015 at 19:01
Quote Posted by LarryG
Given that it is harder to model in DromEd, export it, clean it up, re-texture it, and then generate a valid .bin than it is just to model it in a tool specifically designed for that purpose, why would you ever do that, especially since the end result is very likely to be a much lower quality model when you are all done with your labors?
Because sometimes an object is
already built in DromEd, such that converting it to 3DS would be faster than rebuilding it from scratch in a different, much more complex modeling program.
Derspegn on 6/7/2015 at 19:33
Quote Posted by Niborius
Is there another program which converts 3ds files to bin?
Personally, I have limited experience (and understanding of the thread subject) with these conversions. 3ds2bin.exe hasn't worked for me in Windows 7, and I haven't mastered DosBox commands. Anyway, what has worked for me is using the Blender program. The extension you need for it is the Dark Engine Exporter. Then you can import a .3ds file and export a .bin. Just make sure your files aren't too hi-poly.
