MSX on 16/9/2008 at 21:42
Quote Posted by Jashin
It's interesting how many people who hated Oblivion are excited for Fallout 3. The writing's on the wall that it's gonna be more of Oblivion and less of FO. But hey, bethesda marketing's doing a good job of jedi mind-screwing people.
Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice,
shame on me you can't fool me anymore!!!
I'm both looking to be pleasantly surprised or to see the train wreck. Literally a win win situation for my entertainment dollar.
mothra on 16/9/2008 at 22:22
raiders of the lost ark is an awesome adventure movie, you got me there !
well, since I'm knee-deep in work and can't even properly finish stalker, I'm gonna hold out for Fallout3 (far cry2 is just more my cup of tea) and watch this thread. if the writing's really that bad it could be fun.
but in the end I just hope it's gonna be an excellent overall package with something for eyerone, not only the VATS slo-mo head-exploding crowd.
Angel Dust on 17/9/2008 at 00:40
Quote Posted by mothra
well, then we have different definitions of "cinema lover", I can be pretty passionate about movies and if I don't like them, I don't like them. We could talk on a technical level about SPR, about the brilliant work by its cinematographer Kaminski and the location/design and many other things but at the end of the day I still have to enjoy a movie without having to look at its techincal accomplishments and boy, spielberg's direction and where he puts his emphasis on is just ... annoying for me.
I never said you have to like the film I was just objecting to your statement where you said you would
consciously ignore all the good points of the film, some of which will undoubtedly be Spielberg's choices, just because Spielberg can be a sentimental old fool. It just makes any of your criticism's come across as vitriolic sledging rather than well formed arguments of why you disliked it.
Out of interest what do you think of "Catch Me If You Can"? I was most surprised and pleased with this film, a little overlong perhaps but showcases his natural film making abilities. I also feel he didn't go overboard with the sentimentality either.
Scots Taffer on 17/9/2008 at 02:41
While Spielberg can display a shocking amount of over-sentimentality in his movies, it's not like every movie has to be gritty, "realistic" and depressing in its denouement. Good endings do happen in real life too, you know.
While not the greatest fan of Saving Private Ryan, to call it a "cheesefest" or sentimental is being entirely too harsh and the movie is far more deserving than that. Apart from the depiction of the Omaha landing now being the gold standard of WW2 warfare, many, many scenes stand out as being unremittingly brutal and serve as cold reminders of how ugly, personal and vicious war is lest we ever get caught up in it again. The fact that Spielberg hamfistedly inserts things throughout the movie weakens the overall thematic as a movie but not as a war film.
To be honest, I probably found SPR to be more affecting than Schindlers List for precisely opposing reasons. SL was designed, in many ways, to provoke an emotional reaction through its delivery whereas SPR just unfolds in this messy sprawling way, except for the ending. SL feels a lot more like an exercise in emotional manipulation whereas SPR evokes a strong and instinctual reaction from the audience by pure exposure to the ugliness of war.
Catch Me If You Can was great but vastly forgettable due to the character work being sorely lacking, fantastic production values, soundtrack and direction though. Plus opening titles to die for.
Oh, and Jaws is one of the best movies ever made. I mean that definitively.
Fafhrd on 17/9/2008 at 05:48
Quote Posted by mothra
take munich, another attempt at "intelligence". while the subject matter was very good, the movie was just StevenSpielberg doing a little Tarantino:
This is selling Munich short to such a tremendous degree that I can't even properly articulate how wrongheaded an assessment it is.
Angel Dust on 17/9/2008 at 06:07
Quote Posted by Scots Taffer
Catch Me If You Can was great but vastly forgettable
Strange as it may seem I almost see that as a strength is this films case. Yes, it doesn't resonate and stay with you like the truely great films do but it a purely entertaining film that is extremely easy to watch. I've caught on television a few times now and it always seems to have that fresh feeling since, as you pointed out, it doesn't make a lasting impression. It's nice to have films like that.
Obviously 'Jaws' is the shit and 'Close Encounters of A Third Kind' is also excellent. While I can see where you are coming from regarding 'Schindler's List' as far as some of the closing scenes are concerned, I think you are being more than a little harsh. Watching it again last year I struck with how well Schindler's transformation from war-profiteer to humanitarian was handled. It was a much more internalised process than I remembered and Neeson did an amazing job.
Scots Taffer on 17/9/2008 at 10:44
Quote Posted by Fafhrd
This is selling Munich short to such a tremendous degree that I can't even properly articulate how wrongheaded an assessment it is.
I agree. In fact, Munich showed me that Spielberg is still capable of being an incendiary filmmaker, even for someone as celebrated and upper echelon as he is. I'm not saying it doesn't have its foibles or missteps (that conversation on the stairway would have been the first left on the cutting room floor) but the majority of that movie is very skillfully put together and executed.
Tarantino? what the jesus titty fucking christ?
As for Schindler's List, I can only speak for the only time that I ever watched it which was last year and while I thought it was a very well acted and shot film, the degree to which the audience thrust into the ugliest part of history deserves a level of respect not given with its pregnant pauses and swelling string soundtrack. I'm probably in a minority with that one, but I never want to see it again (and not because I was so harrowed by it).
N'Al on 17/9/2008 at 11:10
Quote Posted by Scots Taffer
As for Schindler's List,[...] I'm probably in a minority with that one, but I never want to see it again (and not because I was so harrowed by it).
No, you're not. I've heard a lot of people put this against SL.
Personally, I'm in two minds on the movie; I can fully understand the criticisms brought against it, but I also believe it's an incredibly well-done movie that treats its subject matter with a lot of respect.
mothra on 17/9/2008 at 13:24
I watched SL in a theatre where some scenes were accompanied by agonizing moans and cries of the audience (that brutal and harsh they were experienced) only to be followed by muted laughter and uncomfortably turning around in the seat, waiting it to end. little red riding hood ? - muted laughter.
And there were some survivors present at the premiere, their reaction in some interviews in austria: you know, it's a movie. they have to sell it as well although we are grateful that the story even gets told for such a big audience.
(see Pasazerka and Shoah instead)
about munich: I stand by my point that most of the scenes are shamelessly stolen from other movies and then presented as intelligent hommage and should add another layer of meaning and readability to the movie. this failed totally for me and with the serious intentions of Munich in mind even more. that's where my tarantion - reference comes from. his movies are harmless, he can steal as much as he wants (it's maybe even the point of his cinema) but spielberg ? maybe he should reference himself, that would make much more sense.
and sorry but JAWS was/is a big yawn. as a kid I was soooooo pumped to see it that I was totally underwhelmed with it and never recovered from it. white shark menace ? I take a plastic rubber suit godzilla monster every day over that boring movie.
I'm no fan of Kubrick either but take his movies over Spielberg's any day and would rate them much higher than anything by SS.
Jashin on 17/9/2008 at 16:36
Quote Posted by MSX
I'm both looking to be pleasantly surprised or to see the train wreck. Literally a win win situation for my entertainment dollar.
Can't you think of a better use for your money than on a train wreck? How about wait a week or two and browse a few forums to see just how good/bad it is.
For 50 bucks I'd rather get a good dinner or round of drinks than a coaster. And the time wasted, god.
