Shadowcat on 25/8/2007 at 07:05
Quote Posted by lunatic96
It seems to me that the developers are promising more than they can actually deliver. A giant world with no loading ever?
It's not that there's no loading. Of course there's loading. It's just that it streams the data gradually while you play (rather than waiting for you to hit a boundary and then doing a bunch of it all at once) so you never actually see a "loading" message.
Boiling Point delivers this, for example. Admittedly I'm told there's a heap of copy-and-paste locations within the BP map, but I
suspect that's more to do with a lack of resources for creating unique areas than the engine's inability to display such unique areas without stopping everything to have a loading session.
Pyrian on 25/8/2007 at 08:56
Yeah, streaming levels is hardly new. It's apparently kind of a pain to program, though - at least I hope so, given how rare it is.
Quote Posted by froghawk
Only the Half-Life games are much more immersive than Far Cry, which felt like it only had a storyline because it had to.
We were arguing about linearity. Immersiveness is pretty subjective. The Half-Life games had a better story, sure, but it doesn't IMO excuse the rail level design. Personally, I can hardly imagine how you managed to FAIL TO NOTICE the incredibly contrived linearity of the Half-Life games.
Quote Posted by froghawk
It was like Doom 3 - another tech demo shooter, only to show off outdoor environments.
Aside from a handful of indoor environments, Far Cry was so little like Doom 3 I don't even know where to go with this. Frankly, I suspect it was Half-Life that made Id realize that they could get away with making a game as painfully linear as Doom 3.
Quote Posted by froghawk
And sorry, but how is being able to skip stuff a high point?
It's less linear. It's more immersive. I get this great feeling of freedom when you can roam around huge lush areas. Sooner or later I've got to go to a given objective, sure (or skip some), but in the meantime I've got this gigantic canvas on which to paint the blood of my enemies.
Quote Posted by froghawk
It's not like you can find anything extra by exploring - you can only miss stuff.
...That's not true. I mean, seriously, it's pretty obvious to me at this point that you didn't LOOK. Most of what's lurking in weird places in Far Cry are enemies, though. But even enemies can be good sources of ammo... And a good sniping position is like gold in a some levels.
Toxicfluff on 25/8/2007 at 08:59
Quote Posted by Jason Moyer
Far Cry was one of the most linear games I've ever played, indoors or out. I also found the AI to be a complete joke.
Most linear? That's bloody ridiculous. I doubt if you even played through the whole game, because it's not at all rare in the later levels to be able to take different routes and do things in an order you like. That already makes it LESS linear than most games.
Whoever mentioned the game taking hints from Stalker and Oblivion at the top -- not really, it's taking hints from what the original Far Cry was promised to be. Originally, it was going to be totally open, with NPCs going about their own business and it wasn't to even have a rigid structure of scripted events with instead semi-random "action bubbles" which would be a scenario selected from a big reservoir of possible encounters.
I'm skeptical of all these big ideas though -- both Far Cry and Stalker promised similar things from the start, and both got to us thoroughly trammelled.
Jason Moyer on 25/8/2007 at 10:37
Quote Posted by ToXiCFLUFF
Most linear? That's bloody ridiculous. I doubt if you even played through the whole game, because it's not at all rare in the later levels to be able to take different routes and do things in an order you like.
Honestly, I don't remember much about the later levels other than being really pissed off by that point and forcing myself to beat them to justify purchasing the game.
DaveW on 25/8/2007 at 15:39
Quote:
Boiling Point delivers this, for example. Admittedly I'm told there's a heap of copy-and-paste locations within the BP map, but I suspect that's more to do with a lack of resources for creating unique areas than the engine's inability to display such unique areas without stopping everything to have a loading session.
Pretty much. The sequel has the same "no loading" thing and has a unique level (no copy and paste jobs). Plus, you have games like GTA that do this too - but they look rubbish since they were made with the PS2 in mind.
froghawk on 25/8/2007 at 15:59
Quote Posted by lunatic96
Yeah, but you can't claim you have the ability to explore and you're stuck in super linearity world at the same time. It's one or the other. You can either choose a bunch of different paths (which you can do) or you can claim it's super linear (which it obviously isn't).
/edit to talk actually talk about far cry 2
It seems to me that the developers are promising more than they can actually deliver. A giant world with no loading ever? I seem to remember STALKER promising that. It definitely sounds interesting, but it seems like they're guaranteeing the moon and I don't see how they'll actually be able to deliver.
The elder scrolls games all had outdoor areas that did this, all of the gothic games are entirely continuous... it's been done before.
Toxicfluff on 25/8/2007 at 16:29
Quote Posted by Jason Moyer
Honestly, I don't remember much about the later levels other than being really pissed off by that point and forcing myself to beat them to justify purchasing the game.
I get that sometimes. Doubtful you bothered to explore much then, eh?
Jason Moyer on 25/8/2007 at 23:28
Quote Posted by ToXiCFLUFF
I get that sometimes. Doubtful you bothered to explore much then, eh?
:erm:
The level where you're driving a vehicle at the end, just before the final boss battle (IIRC) I did some exploring, but that was just because I couldn't find a way to get over some of the crevices you need to jump.
Toxicfluff on 25/8/2007 at 23:43
Quote Posted by Jason Moyer
:erm:
The level where you're driving a vehicle at the end, just before the final boss battle (IIRC) I did some exploring, but that was just because I couldn't find a way to get over some of the crevices you need to jump.
Boss battle? Were you playing on the X-box? All I got in the way of the bad guys' capitulation was a weedy little scientist cowering on his knees.
froghawk on 26/8/2007 at 00:31
Quote Posted by ToXiCFLUFF
Boss battle? Were you playing on the X-box? All I got in the way of the bad guys' capitulation was a weedy little scientist cowering on his knees.
er... I got a boss battle too, and never bothered to beat it.
