Balboa on 15/2/2009 at 13:36
Vandal has one, but there is also a readable in the mission that tells you it's there, and suggests why. I generally think that there should be some reason for loot to be inside a sealed object in the game. If it's just scattered loot, then it doesn't make as much sense.
jiansonz on 15/2/2009 at 14:41
Midnight in Murkbell also has one. There is a readable that mentions it. This way to do it is fine by me, but hiding random pieces of loot in crates without leaving hints is just evil.
SneakyJack on 15/2/2009 at 15:45
I've never found a piece of loot or a usable item inside a crate - I very, very rarely break them at all unless they break as I'm throwing them aside to get through a passageway. I've never been good at crate stacking (or elevatoring or whatever its called) so I leave those shenanigans up to the experts. If I read something at some point that told me something was inside a crate I've probably skipped it and finished the mission to be honest. Some missions expand and get epic enough in scope that something silly like crate bashing falls by the wayside for me. :laff:
I didn't even know it was possible to hide items inside crates and barrels until someone mentioned it in a mission thread. :D
I know its a common thing in FPS games of the past though.
R Soul on 15/2/2009 at 15:56
There are lots of things FM authors can do, but most of us realise that can and should are not the same.
E.g. I once considered having books that could not be read if the lights were off. After a brief discussion here, I removed that setup.
People work out the rules of gameplay in the original missions, and those rules are reinforced in the vast majority of FMs. If such basic things as reading books and smashing crates are to work differently in an FM, there really should be a good reason, rather than a showcase of the author's technical skills.
SneakyJack on 15/2/2009 at 16:03
Quote Posted by R Soul
There are lots of things FM authors can do, but most of us realise that
can and
should are not the same.
E.g. I once considered having books that could not be read if the lights were off. After a brief discussion here, I removed that setup.
People work out the rules of gameplay in the original missions, and those rules are reinforced in the vast majority of FMs. If such basic things as reading books and smashing crates are to work differently in an FM, there really should be a good reason, rather than a showcase of the author's technical skills.
To be honest, the "only reading books in the light" idea would be pretty hilarious to me - even if it did frustrate me at the same time.. its still a funny concept - then again I have a very dark sense of humor. :D
You have a very good point - and I guess there should be a basic template of gameplay "rules" that missions should stick to - its fun to deviate once in a while but like you also mentioned it has to be said somewhere that you need to be on the lookout for it when you are playing the mission.
Another thing I've noticed and wanted to talk about is readables in general. I like readables that display text on the screen in subtitle form directly after frobbing the item rather than the ones that take you to a different screen and cause you to have to exit and such. It just makes for much smoother gameplay - makes me wonder why more authors don't use this method of display.
Perhaps its just my personal preference - but it just seems so much less time consuming and immersion breaking if the text is displayed directly above the item.
I know it may not be as dramatic of a read for longer items but I'd rather just frob it a few times while reading and stay inside the normal view.
DrK on 15/2/2009 at 16:04
Can't agree more with R Soul :p
And I understand you'd like readables directly onscreen, it's indeed smoother and would be interesting for gameplay (you have to make sure noone is around when you read). But if the book in question has at least 10 pages of writing, like in my fms for example, what would happen ?
However, to display text onscreen should be done everytime with little readables : I hate to read a plaque which leads you to a different screen, only to read a room's name.
Nameless Voice on 15/2/2009 at 16:59
Quote Posted by SneakyJack
I know it may not be as dramatic of a read for longer items but I'd rather just frob it a few times while reading and stay inside the normal view.
I have a script that can be used to make such text stay on screen until the player looks away, which is even better than having to frob it a few times. This was used by (and written for) Eshaktaar in
Broken Triad.
I'd also thought of the "Only reading books in the light" idea, it does make sense...
SneakyJack on 15/2/2009 at 17:30
Quote Posted by DrK
Can't agree more with R Soul :p
And I understand you'd like readables directly onscreen, it's indeed smoother and would be interesting for gameplay (you have to make sure noone is around when you read). But if the book in question has at least 10 pages of writing, like in my fms for example, what would happen ?
However, to display text onscreen should be done everytime with little readables : I hate to read a plaque which leads you to a different screen, only to read a room's name.
Is it possible to use a script like the one Nameless Voice made to make a readable display the text onscreen for page one for a few seconds, then change to page two and so on as long as the player doesnt move? Page transitions could be signaled by adding a .... to the end of any page that is about to change.
I dunno, just an idea. I don't know what is possible in dromed and what isnt.
Nameless Voice on 15/2/2009 at 17:33
Maybe changing to the second page if you frob it again would make more sense, otherwise you'd have to predict how long it would take the player to read it.
I always wanted to make readables like in Deus Ex where the readable appears in a window but the game continues in the background.
SneakyJack on 15/2/2009 at 17:48
Quote Posted by Nameless Voice
Maybe changing to the second page if you frob it again would make more sense, otherwise you'd have to predict how long it would take the player to read it.
I always wanted to make readables like in Deus Ex where the readable appears in a window but the game continues in the background.
Even better, of course - I was just unsure of how far we could push the game engine with this frob specific scripting and whatnot - im sure you pretty much know it inside and out, and after what I've seen in a few fan missions lately it seems anything is possible :laff:
