God.. they had it all in their hands and spoiled it completely... - by Vincent_21
ZylonBane on 6/6/2006 at 15:35
Quote Posted by New Horizon
The change in art direction, poor animation and poor character control is hardly a matter of habit...it's a fact and has been addressed by the developers themselves, some of whom I've spoken to in private.
Oh really? Did they ever give a reason why T1/2's distinctive pseudo-steampunk aesthetic was jettisoned in TDS?
Goldmoon Dawn on 6/6/2006 at 16:14
Quote Posted by Bikerdude
I f you head on over the circle and read Randy Smiths interview you`ll see LGS simply ran out of money....
True, but it is far from simple.
Quote:
To make the knife cut even more keenly, just one day before its closing, Eidos Interactive, Looking Glass' parent publisher, finally released Daikatana -- created by Ion Storm, another studio within the Eidos fold. Many game industry observers had wondered if Daikatana's moment would ever come, considering the legendary delays, mutinies and overruns that had stretched its production time to three controversial years.
Eidos spent, by some estimates, nearly $30 million to ensure Daikatana's completion. (Thief II, by contrast, cost an estimated $2.5 million to develop.) But Daikatana's mastermind, John Romero, has now earned some of the most savage reviews a major game designer has received in recent years. For outraged gamers, the confluence of fortune was too infuriating to forgive. Surely a fraction of that capital could have been diverted to save Looking Glass? Via flames and even cartoons, the accusation roared through online gaming boards: John Romero and Eidos killed Looking Glass.
~s:a:n:i:t:y~ on 6/6/2006 at 16:15
Quote Posted by New Horizon
but you are wrong in suggesting that the core fanbase is simply complaining because nothing is exactly the same.
I definitely didn't mean that! I was simply defending my opinion. All your reasons sound very persuasive. And it's not about being right or wrong. It's just that I find TDS as perfect as you probably find T1 r T2 or both. To my opinion, it needs no changes. In my opinion, it is a whole, beautifull story that needs no corrections. You might try to prove me wrong, and you even may think you've sucseeded, and to other people maybe you would. But I cannot agree with
"God.. they had it all in their hands and spoiled it completely..." It is only my point of view. But I'm a fan, too. And so it counts as well :)
Fragony on 6/6/2006 at 16:18
It's tragic lookingglass died, but to blaim it on another game, a bigger budget wouldn't have changed the times where stealth was too new for the majority of gamers.
(And am I the only one that thought Daikatana wasn't that bad?)
Goldmoon Dawn on 6/6/2006 at 16:25
Quote Posted by ~s:a:n:i:t:y~
It's just that I find TDS as perfect as you probably find T1 r T2 or both. To my opinion, it needs no changes. In my opinion, it is a whole, beautifull story that needs no corrections. But I cannot agree with
"God.. they had it all in their hands and spoiled it completely..." It is only my point of view. But I'm a fan, too. And so it counts as well :)
Yeah, it's just kind of strange, because this series has been around for a long time, and made it's name on lofty game design principles, that were seemingly abandoned with part "III".
The strange part is that, while they abandoned most of the wants of the previous set of fans, they took what was left and geared it towards an entirely new set of fans!
It worked!
The newbies can't stop oozing over this game.
Perhaps what they spoiled completely was the remaining faith in the true original fans? Now, if Deadly Shadows broke through and sold millions of copies, I would bow to Ion and try the thing again, searching for the magical secrets I had missed. Obviously, that isn't the case. The game "possibly didn't even recover costs".
No biggy, for the new fans, but what happens to the core audience, who by the way, is still waiting in the wings and is growing larger by the day! I've already seen on this Forum plenty of newbies converting to Dark Project.
:ebil:
Goldmoon Dawn on 6/6/2006 at 16:38
Quote Posted by Fragony
It's tragic lookingglass died,
The point is and was, that Looking Glass had a collection of elite (several from MIT) programmers, designers, and artists all assembled in one holy place at one holy time. The company was more than just a company! It was a unique entity. It more than deserved any and all funding to continue.
You are right in saying it was tragic that this group couldn't stay together, just a little while longer until "stealth" became more accessible, at which time the company could rise out like a pheonix and take it's rightful place as master of the genre *they* created. I mean created in a literal sense. They built the *entire* engine to do what they wanted and needed as it arose during development.
In fact, it has been argued that Looking Glass built the first working true 3d game engine (free movement as opposed to step-by-step movement) with the Ultima Underworld series.
Thief I wasn't this amazing group's only accomplishment, it was just the pinnacle of their overall combined abilities.
But hey, like Warren said, the silver lining is that now the group has the luxury of being scattered across the universe of the game industry.
Fragony on 6/6/2006 at 16:50
Game cannot be praised enough, it will always be my absolute favorite, but the game was unfocused. I believe they even admitted that it was somewhat of an experiment, and that they weren't sure what it should have been. That is hardly a good way to run a succesfull company if you don't even know who you want to buy the game, so you could argue that they kinda owe it to theirselves. At least they left us with an absolute masterpiece and a rabid fanbase/modding community, I am ok with that.
Goldmoon Dawn on 6/6/2006 at 17:02
Yes, we will have to be.
And also, Looking Glass was the first company to introduce sound propagation, bringing Eric's sfx to life like never before.
Creating new tech for masterful simulations was their forte, correct. They happened to focus those years and abilities into one title, correct.
Still, that is no reason to break up a group of people that if they were thriving still today, who knows what *new* things they would be creating!
Goldmoon Dawn on 6/6/2006 at 18:05
I'm just saying that this group was a bunch of angels that should have been lifted up on a cloud to do whatever they wanted for however long they wanted, through endless funding. :cheeky:
~s:a:n:i:t:y~ on 6/6/2006 at 19:22
no doubds bout that:cheeky:
