Briareos H on 20/7/2011 at 14:46
Quote Posted by Subjective Effect
Other ways: making it look nicer, improving the UI, fine tuning the in-game mechanics, giving the player more gameplay options. I could go on.
I agree with your points related to the presentation of the game. I was too hasty in dismissing the graphics and UI. More people are willing to try an extremely pretty and slick game, that is true.
More gameplay options somehow goes with my point as those options would have to be considered 'less hardcore' for the general public ie. dumbing down the general feel. Anyway, the whole thing would mean maintaining balance for two or three vastly different branches of the gameplay. This is probably what LGS would try to do if they were with us today.
Considering the stance of the leaders on the EM team ("you can't toggle third person off during takedowns because they look so cool1!"), there is very little chance that increased speed, third-person parkour and guard takedowns will be added to the game and then turned off for higher difficulty levels. So whatever the difficulty we play on, we may not see the slow, methodical pace with self-inflicted tension of the originals. We can probably count on less hand-holding for level navigation and loot collecting, higher AI sensitivity, still.
zachary1975 on 20/7/2011 at 20:06
Quote Posted by lost_soul
but I'll be waiting this time to see what kinds of opinions the community has about the new games.
you'll definitely here my opinion when i finish it.;)
Xorak on 23/7/2011 at 20:39
Quote Posted by Subjective Effect
I don't know man. I get what you're saying but making something more appealing to the masses doesn't always mean it's dumbing down or spoiling things. I've stated, and explained, many times that I believe that you can achieve it all with settings/difficulty settings.
I agree with this sentiment. I think video games are the only thing you can make appeal to everybody but still retain the quality and uniqueness that made them standout originally, because of the capibility to alter options and difficulty settings.
Unfortunately, the designers often take the easy way out though, and just shove the same pile of crap out to all people.
I loathe how making everything appeal to everybody has killed every form of entertainment. It's all been reduced to the lowest possible denominator.
jtr7 on 23/7/2011 at 21:34
Technical feasibility is not in question. Industrial trends, marketing formulae, going for the money and larger demographics, doing too much and losing the focus, and other things that make the likelihood of choices being made to begin with all the way to follow-through, are where the doubt comes from. It's always been this way. A pure Thief game takes risks and is not favored by the masses. It hasn't happened very often, and that's a fact, and that's the source of the doubt. Also, saying something is possible, but being very vague about how and ignoring logistics and likelihood don't cut it. Not at all.
SubJeff on 24/7/2011 at 11:35
It's a shame you weren't there when The Dark Mod was being designed jtr.
We had a long discussion about how difficulty sliders could be implemented that would allow the same game, the same level, to be vastly different.
If you alter the rules for the player and the AI in a game like Thief you can have, on one hand, a fairly casual "hide and snipe" game where you kill everyone, using the bow is easy, you get in swordfights and can run and hide if you're losing because the AI is fairly dumb and so on.
On the other hand you can have game with AI that is smart and tough, where your arrows have to hit specific points to penetrate armour, where AI get help, will cream you in a swordfight and look for you, properly, if you try hide.
It's not hard.
Xorak on 24/7/2011 at 21:17
Exactly. The unfortunate part is that that's usually one of the last things implemented into the final design. Just look at Deux Ex HR and the removal of the 'orange glow' around all the frobbable objects. If the designers were pushed up against the clock (as almost every single company is) they wouldn't have the time to tweak it. I'm a believer that most designers actually go in with the idea of different options/playstyles, and these get pushed to the side the closer to crunch time they get.
mothra on 25/7/2011 at 11:52
problem is, difficulty settings and its differences should be part of the initial design, not something slapped on at the end.
zachary1975 on 29/7/2011 at 00:12
Quote Posted by zachary1975
you'll definitely here my opinion when i finish it.;)
i recently read (
http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=134967) first thief 4 pictures and if the rumor is true you may not hear my opinion.:erg:
jtr7 on 29/7/2011 at 01:43
Well, don't let rumor and theory based on subjective hopes and concerns stop you from offering opinion you know may not apply to the facts of T4 now and later in any way.
