rainynight65 on 27/5/2009 at 05:17
The current consoles do not have the limitations that were around when TDS was made. Look at games like Far Cry 2 or GTA 4 to see what is possible. These days I think the limits are more prevalent in the developer's minds than in the systems. And there is no reason why Thief 4 couldn't do away with the gripes of TDS and be a great game on any system - unless the devs screw it up.
Bakerman on 27/5/2009 at 08:06
Quote Posted by Taffer36
On a keyboard where you have all the buttons in the world, this is fine.
However, there is NO REASON at all why this can't be translated to the Xbox in a more streamlined, less confusing manner. The Xbox controller has more than enough buttons, actually. More than that on a controller is pushing it.
I am interested how they would translate the inventory system over, though. Scrolling thru weapons like TDS? Real-time inventory like Resident Evil 5? Paused-game inventory like Fallout 3?
You got to it first - yes, there is no reason why you couldn't just strip away all the extraneous buttons in there and fit the thing onto a console controller. I'd think that the inventory can just be translated straight onto the controller, using the bumpers to scroll through it and then another button to select an inventory item or something. Triggers for attacking and frobbing, dual-stick controls (click the look stick to lean, click the move stick to crouch), etc. Also, you wouldn't have to deal with speed controls, since you've got analog input.
Okay, that was my little diversion :P
Quote:
I also read a post in T4 Anticipation recently that said that the reason TDS' gameplay was so screwed up and why there were no water arrows or swimmable water was because the devs decided to incorporate the 3rd person option and that affected not only the gameplay, but what Garrett in the 3rd person could or couldn't do. Here I'd always believed the faults listed above were because the game had been created for Xbox as well as the PC and that concessions had to be made since console gaming is different from PC gaming.
I think we've got to be careful what we blame the Xbox for causing. For example, there is no sane reason why they could not have put swimmable water in an Xbox game. It doesn't make sense to blame the Xbox for our lack of swimmable water. That was a decision by the developers, not a limitation inherent to the console. I'd hazard to say the same about rope arrows. Loading zones are about the only thing I can think of that the Xbox forced on the developers - and that was a
big concession. It should have been rectified on the PC, but that's just another example of the way developers don't treat the PC market as qual to the console market.
Platinumoxicity on 27/5/2009 at 08:19
Ion Storm should have made the best game that was possible and the console people should have waited until their favorite company releases a console powerful enough to play it. Don't ever neglect the primary platform to prevent yourself from neglecting the secondary platform. Priorities, man.
I just wrote a whole lot of text and didn't say jack sh*t. :p
MoroseTroll on 27/5/2009 at 08:29
Quote Posted by rainynight65
The current consoles do not have the limitations that were around when TDS was made.
Yes, you're right. But 512 MB of X360 and PS3 is much less than average PC has these days (2048 and 3072 MB are two most popular configurations according to (
http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/) Valve's Steam Hardware Survey). So in Thief 4 we can get a maps with Tomb Raider: Underworld' size and detalization or... with lesser size and more detalization. The last case seems to me more real because Thief 4 absolutely needs much more detalization rather than Tomb Raider: Underworld.
Quote Posted by rainynight65
Look at games like Far Cry 2 or GTA 4 to see what is possible.
Do you know how large their budgets? They were huge: rumors has it that the GTA 4'th one was over $100M (yes, one hundred million bucks:eek:)! Do you really think that Thief 4'th one has even more the $10M? I'm not sure. So, yes, current generation consoles are capable, but only with proper (I mean - vast) financing.
So, dear taffers, prepare to meet Thief 4 with average level of map size and detalization. Do you want something more? Then pay attention to TDM.
Chade on 27/5/2009 at 09:25
T3 funding was about 11-12 million ... and that was on the last generation of consoles!
GTA4 is an exceptionally well funded game, but still ... I imagine T4 funding will be somewhere around the 25-40 million mark.
Quote Posted by Platinumoxicity
Don't ever neglect the primary platform to prevent yourself from neglecting the secondary platform. Priorities, man.
You don't think they should have released T3 on PC? :confused:
;)
MoroseTroll on 27/5/2009 at 09:45
Quote Posted by Chade
T3 funding was about 11-12 million ... and that was on the last generation of consoles!
Maybe, but that was in Texas, USA. And Thief 4 is in development in Montreal, Canada, which is cheaper enough, AFAIK. I've heard that Crysis costs EA just for $20M or little more, so I doubt about $25-40M for Thief 4. The place of development does matter :).
Namdrol on 27/5/2009 at 12:24
Quote Posted by webe123
And remember that the thing that has kept the Thief series going all these years is NOT the PC, console or any of the store versions...it was the FAN MISSIONS! When is the last time you saw a thief fan mission for a console? I have not heard of one! (Because as far as I am aware, there are NO fan missions for thief on any console,....at least none I have ever heard of!)
Exactly, it's an odd one. Thief 4 will be cross platform, they can't afford not to be, but it will only exist because of us, And because we love that world that could only have been developed on PC.
I'm PC to the bone, but you know what? When TDS come out, I was broke, my laptop was to decrepit to run it and I'd just been dumped and needed to lose myself in Garrets world. So I went to a pawn shop bought, an X-box for £75, bought TDS and did nothing else but work and taff for two weeks, I then sold the X box soon as I'd finished. It was all right, it played.
Playing it back on the PC there's no difference cept I like it less and feel sad that it's so crap. I'm just finishing the Museum but I enjoy cruising through these forums more so it's taking an age. Which shouldn't be.
Anyway, Thief 4 doesn't have to be identical from PC to console and it won't screw the budget if they start like that from the beginning.
I just want an intelligent game that is hard and scares the pants of me.
You know the main thing different from console to PC? Killing things. I want to sneak, not crouch and stab 4 times, then take a health potion.
cYmoZz on 27/5/2009 at 18:42
Quote Posted by Brethren
I think the era of PC exclusive titles basically ended when id software claimed they were developing their new game (Rage) primarily for the 360.
I doubt that id software really said that. What I remember reading was something like that they are going to make it their first real multi-platform title.
on the topic: Yes, I think that if they would make t4 PC only, it would become a better game than if it was multi-platform.
Eidos would be stupid to if they ignored the console market, so I hope they will at least put some effort in the pc version.
Jilly The Taffer on 27/5/2009 at 21:20
There are some great games that are on many consoles including PC, like Oblivion and Assassins Creed. They are exactly the same on PC as they are on PS3, graphics-wise, gameplay-wise ect...
After the let-down of DS in general, I think most of us blame that is sucks because it was made for a console also. Not because the game just lacked everything we loved about DP and MA.
I know that Eidos Montreal will make a great effort with Thief 4, and it will be greatly improved from the Deadly Shadows mistakes.
Therefore, if it turns out to be an amazing and pleasing game in general, it won't necarssarily make a difference if it's on consoles.
Anyway, I don't think we have a choice with Eidos, they released Tomb Raider Legend and Underworld on PC, Xbox, Wii and PS3.
Chade on 27/5/2009 at 21:47
Quote Posted by MoroseTroll
Maybe, but that was in Texas, USA. And Thief 4 is in development in Montreal, Canada, which is cheaper enough, AFAIK. I've heard that Crysis costs EA just for $20M or little more, so I doubt about $25-40M for Thief 4. The place of development does matter :).
That's interesting. I hope we'll find out eventually!
