Queue on 7/2/2015 at 21:57
Quote Posted by Kolya
What you took as a cue to talk about the stupidity of esoteric believers was actually an inclusive description from my side: The "stupid primates who delude themselves that they were surly able to distinguish truth from fiction" are you and me. Because of how human brains work, ie by repetition, which builds up stronger and stronger neural connections, regardless whether you initially believe the fact that's being repeated or not. If you were indifferent you will be convinced. But if you believe the fact being repeated to be a lie you will have to expend at least equal amounts of energy to stay convinced that it's a lie. For example by telling unsuspecting people on the internet how stupid it all is.
Oh, okay. If that's the case, then I certainly continue to stick by my statement. Especially for the benefit of unsuspecting, stupid people.
Tony_Tarantula on 7/2/2015 at 22:14
Ignore queue, he's clearly mind controlled!
As far as conspiracies, I agree 100% with George Carlin:
[video=youtube;VAFd4FdbJxs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAFd4FdbJxs[/video]
Pay attention to Demagogue. He went into a bit more depth than I did, but it's a good description of what I said earlier. The hidden symbolism isn't proof of a conspiracy but a way of highlighting complex philosophical and religious ideas into an easy to understand metaphor.
Demagogue, You've also perked my interest with the specific geographic areas and languages you've mentioned. In particular since that is the area that DCS strains originated from. PM me with some more specifics.
There's definitely something up with that era-time period though. While doing some academic research on another, unrelated topic I came across a few journal articles that contained some extremely weird shit.....basically to the effect that there are some anomolies in the human genome, that scientists performing the studies estimated occurred about the time that Homo Sapiens first appeared in the Olduvai Gorge. The study also had some analysis to the effect that these changes couldn't be explained through natural evolution.
demagogue on 8/2/2015 at 02:11
I just meant if you buy the punctuated equilibrium model of evolution, it happens in critical spurts and is environmentally sensitive, then that environment explains a lot about the human soul. There's also the idea that the deeper you look into yourself, the further back in phylogenic time you go. Our deepest fears were planted in our reptilian and earlier inheretence.
That can get into some freaky 2001 shit if you follow up on it, and it makes sense of how Kubrick connected evolution and alchemy.
As for the click languages, they're apparently the remnants of language and culture's origins (languages add phonemes the older they are, and those have the most), which apparently evolved quite a bit before homo sapiens among much earlier homo or even earlier(?) lines. So while we have the bodies of men, we have minds inherited from other species, and language, culture, symbols, religion, and meaning didn't actually originate from us at all ... if you buy that theory.
demagogue on 9/2/2015 at 02:22
Yeah, that's why I was hedging so much in describing it. It's not a knock-down case.
There's a book I like called The Prehistory of Language, and that was more interested in things like red ocher makeup and shell necklaces, and the persuasive idea I thought that language probably evolved more for women's gossip than men's pack hunting.
That's the problem with mixing science and mysticism though. You're supposed to give reverence to mystical secret knowledge, but scientific claims always have to be subject to ridicule and skepticism. It's like all those '60s books on quantum physics and mysticism were trying to be profound, but a lot of their scientific claims have been trashed by now and the whole effect just fizzles. Now we're at a point with string theory where the theories don't even connect to the real world anymore, and nobody wants to say much of anything because they know it'll be trashed within 6 months... Well it's not anything the laity can ever hope to follow to begin with, much less make meaning out of. Quantum physics at least had some weird relationship with observation, which makes it sound like it's related to consciousness. But string theory...?
The future of secret knowledge is out of our hands now. I propose we invent sentient robots as quickly as possible, as they at least might have the chance to understand what we can't.
Tony_Tarantula on 9/2/2015 at 17:41
The ridicule of either science or mysticism is the domain of idiots, demagogues, and ideological frauds.
heywood on 9/2/2015 at 21:12
Quote Posted by demagogue
There's also the idea that the deeper you look into yourself, the further back in phylogenic time you go.
Is that Buddhist?
Reading it reminded of (
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080360/) Altered States
Slasher on 11/2/2015 at 01:59
in a world full of people
only some want to fly
isn't that crazay
craaaaaaaaaazaay
demagogue on 11/2/2015 at 02:19
Quote Posted by heywood
Is that Buddhist?
I think the idea comes from the saying "ontogony recapitulates phylogony", which means you're put together in the womb in the same order that evolution went through, from single cell organism to chordate to fish to lizard to mouse to monkey to human. Then what I said was just the same idea looking at it from the inside of your own experience, since the parts of you put together earlier in the womb give you the more basic, primeval experiences.
Phylogenic time means back in evolutionary history. Your most basic consciousness and fear reflexes come from fish & lizards; your emotions come from small mammals; your social experience comes from primates; and the really highlevel stuff from humans.
In Buddhism, your next life is determined by karma from your actions in this life. So you could come back in your next life as a snake if you sleep too much (which is what my Buddhist girlfriend used to always warn me). And I think it's a problem if you have any memory of a past life at all. So ... I don't think it's all that Buddhist. But Buddhists are into putting aside the distractions of day-to-day experience to focus on the deep stuff in their experience, and that's what meditation and the 8 way path to enlightenment, etc, are mostly about as I understand it. IMO they're talking about basically the same thing. I just don't think a Buddhist would want to admit it's not really nirvana they're after, just the slug part of their brain.
Nicker on 11/2/2015 at 04:08
I attended a lecture given by R.A. Wilson in the early 80's.
He told lots of interesting stories about specific conspiracies, especially involving the Masons / Illuminati. Sometimes they were the bad guys and sometimes the good guys and often they were just ineffectual, lawnmower-riding, middle-aged men with a love of ritual and funny hats.
I asked if there were any general lessons, about the nature of conspiracies and conspirators, we might take from this constantly evolving story. Wilson concluded (IIRC) that there are only two things we can say for certain about conspiracies:
1) Conspiracies exist.
2) Not even the conspirators are aware of the true nature of any conspiracy they are involved in.
