New Horizon on 7/2/2006 at 14:24
Most of the things left open for tweaking were cosmetic, superficial. The real power would have come if Ion had somehow left the scripting system open for users to write their own new scripts...or if we had access to an SDK. Too many things were locked down
ZylonBane on 7/2/2006 at 14:44
Am I the only one who thinks the health "gems" look like hot dogs?
Goldmoon Dawn on 7/2/2006 at 14:56
:cheeky:
Verily.
Rogue Keeper on 7/2/2006 at 15:30
Coming to hot dogs, didn't we solve this BLACKJACK=VIBRATOR issue once and forever...
New Horizon on 7/2/2006 at 16:14
Quote Posted by BR796164
Coming to hot dogs, didn't we solve this BLACKJACK=VIBRATOR issue once and forever...
:eek:
sparhawk on 7/2/2006 at 18:46
Quote Posted by 242
I didn't say how they were implemented, they could be implemented better (not so comic-like). I said about the concept. Oil flasks and choking with moss are great ideas. As well as combining effects of several arrows.
Yeah. Great idea. Really! *yawn* What was it again? Ah! HAHAHA!
Quote:
You know you so like to put down TDS from time to time that I seriously fear the worst for the Dark Mod, it's a bad sign when devs put down other "concurent" games loooong befere their own product is ready and can be objectively compared by independent player.
So you say that because we are doing a similar game, we are no longer allowed to have an opinion something?
Quote Posted by Domarius
Well put it this way - if money was their sole driving force, they would have made it like T3 in the first place. They could have taken this easy way out but they didn't.
If they had made it purely for the money, they would have done a market analysis (or already known it) and the result would have been yet another FP shooter. Instead they tried something new. Of course they made it for money, but they did not forget tha creative part about it.
Quote Posted by BR796164
With all T3 gameplay downers, we are lucky it has so many possibilities for re-configuration. It's as if the devs were avare that old PC fans won't be satisfied with this and that, they made things as they were expected to, to appeal "bosses above", but they left us many CFG/INI files opened for editation. So we can change almost every feature.
Thanks them for that. Not all A-class games are so easily adaptable.
This comment really shows that you have no clue at all about programming, and modding. Looking at TDS from a programmers perspective, it is painfully obvious that it was NEVER designed with configurabillity in mind. The amount of configuration we see in TDS is the absolute minimum required to create a game in the first place. If you develop such a software, it would be a big disadvantage for teh developer to have no configuration possibilities, because it slows down production if you constantly have to test and recompile even for minor changes. I have never seen the sourcecode, but you can read a lot from the limitations that are built into TDS, which clearly speak of timepressure and no vision of future reuse. If you have some experience in professional programming and look at TDS you can easily see this. And funny thing is, that I made assumptions based on the game even before T3Ed was released, and I was correct about them, because I know how software development works in many companies. And at the end of the day, a game is still yet another software development cycle.
Quote Posted by New Horizon
Most of the things left open for tweaking were cosmetic, superficial. The real power would have come if Ion had somehow left the scripting system open for users to write their own new scripts...or if we had access to an SDK. Too many things were locked down
If they would have done that they would have opened another can of worms. I know that it wouldn't have bothered us here at all, but from the projects point of view it makes sense. In the end, I'm not really sorry about this though. After all, TDM would have never come to pass and it gave me a good opportunity to actually start game development. :) After all I have plans for other games now as well, which are currently in the planning stage. :)
Norman Druart on 7/2/2006 at 22:47
Quote Posted by BR796164
Coming to hot dogs, didn't we solve this BLACKJACK=VIBRATOR issue once and forever...
It's a lot harder to render someone unconscious with one than the other. Still possible though.
Goldmoon Dawn on 8/2/2006 at 00:47
:cheeky:
Rogue Keeper on 8/2/2006 at 09:18
sparhawk:
I have just a little clue about programming and modding. Fortunately I have some programmers around who can enlighten me a bit. That could be also you, thanks.
You are looking at TDS' configurability from programmers perspective, while
I'm looking at it from perspective of an AVERAGE USER with little programming/modding ambitions who doesn't need to disassemble every game into little pieces of code, said a bit exaggeratedly. Not that such a disassembly and hard modification of intellectual property would be legally twice okay in the first place, as legal disclaimers coming with software usually suggest, but that's a different issue.
I'll be repeating myself, but I still believe that there are far more options to tweak merely in the CFGs/INIs than an average user ever tries to, or will be ever interested in tweaking - the TDS Tweak Guide thread offers so many sweet options. I'm not arguing that TDS is perfect, I'm saying that most of the obvious imperfections can be easily repaired. Most of the negative aspects of gameplay criticized by the community can be easily tweaked - graphics, menu and GUI, font sizes, even your movement and physics, to limited extent. Several tweaking tools and add-ons have been made for people's convenience, including hi-res textures. Irony is that we have superior fan-made textures for TDS and no such thing for previous Thef games...
And now let's try to imagine what number of all TDS players (on PC platform of course) ever try to tweak a single element of the game. Because I'm afraid that vast majority of TDS players aren't much skilled in programming either. If they didn't have convenient tools like TDS Tweaker, I think this number would be even a bit lower. Almost worth of a survey.
I know you programmers like to have every software to be configurable like Linux, but most of average users don't need it. And this isn't open source or an indie soft in the first place - it's a heavily commercial software and whether we like it or not, its publisher would have principal full right to ship it as much protected from tampering as he wishes to.
That's not a programmer's point of view, that's an attempt of legal and commercial point of view, and point of view of an average "gaming kid". Now you try to accept it for a moment and you could easily see this.
But personally I have bad experiences with convincing a certain programmer to try accept a different perspective. Advanced professional deformation, probably.
OrbWeaver on 8/2/2006 at 12:27
It's not a matter of perspective. TDS is not configurable when compared with other games which have a lot more options you can set, in-game consoles etc. Whether TDS has more options that than the user wants to adjust is irrelevant, particularly since many of these options are useless and some of them do nothing anyway.
