In the interest of Nostalgia, what would make a multiplayer game 'Thiefish" to you?

SalaciousCrumb on 23/3/2008 at 22:53

Your character could be captured when defeated and thrown into prison. Then other players of your faction could be given the mission to free you or others out of the enemy's jail. You will have to pay them though.
Or maybe the faction which captured you wants you to pay for your freedom, so if you have very much money at your treasure chest, you could ask someone to bring it to them to pay the ransom.

jtr7 on 29/3/2008 at 05:44

Happy Birthday, thiefinthedark. Hope your Design Doc submission opens doors for you, good ones, even if they aren't expected.

Thief13x on 30/3/2008 at 16:07

Quote Posted by thiefinthedark

in Dromed

you didn't have to curse:D

love the sound of this, I'm not huge on online games (or games in general these days) but this is definatly something I would love to see..as long as it will run on my 1.1ghz processor, 256mb ram and 64mb graphics card of a laptop:ebil:

thiefinthedark on 3/4/2008 at 03:16

Thank you all for the positive responses! I honestly wasn't expecting the idea to be recieved as well as it has (predicted far more laughter in my general direction.)

The design is coming along well, as it should be since it is due to be submitted by the 14th of April!

I've been giving some thought to social stealth, allowing players to impersonate as being in other great houses in order to infiltrate them, ala the spy in TF2 perhaps. But the player death problem is quite a conundrum. I am trying to think of a way to have respawning carry a true penalty in order to have players avoid death at all costs, but so far a "Rechargable Regeneration Locket" purchased from the Theocracy in control of the city is all i have come up with.

I'll try and keep you guys updated better, and post the whole thing here when i'm done with it, for your reading pleasure! ;)

The Magpie on 3/4/2008 at 11:58

See (http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1713896#post1713896) the post by jtr7 for what I'd enjoy seeing in the game. As to gameplay elements: Sneaking and exploring while undetected by patrols is for me the core of Thief - together with the semi-sadistic rush of power when pacifying a dangerous enemy with one blow, just because I managed to stay undetected. And gathering shiny, prettiful loot.

I believe 500 players per server is far, far too much. Try 20% of that, IF there is supposed to be some kind of balancing of factions in place. Otherwise one risks one faction becoming vastly more popular (and powerful) than the others, and trying to topple them becomes too daunting for players to even bother trying. With a lower number, people might just become more attached to each other and their faction, as they get to know both their firends and enemies better.

On Death:
Will all of the player characters have equal abilities? I mean, would there be a lot of Garretts running and jumping around? If so, the apprentice inheritance idea could IMO have been a good one - except that that, too, kind of ruins immersion, especially WRT social issues - one couldn't expect an apprentice to have the same connections as a master. The prison idea is really the best so far, but how to handle drowning, beasts, traps, and falling damage? ...hm. you've probably thought of it already, but still an idea:

For non-character inflicted death, how about returning the mystery of the unknown helpers, the Dei ex machina. Like the Keepers in TDP, at the start of Escape! - They could have done a traditional MUD transporting of the body away to ...wherever such benefactors choose to hang out. Temple, shrine, barrow, abandoned warehouse. That respawn area would likely be crowded with player characters, though, so one could look into having e.g. a short waiting period as penalty for dying, while waiting in line to be revived. Of course, waiting around staring at a static computer screen would be pretty boring, so other solutions would be good, too. Because the death penalty is a real problem. You've seen this (http://rangersheck.com/2007/6/4/the-death-penalty-handling-defeat-in-crpg-design) blog entry?

Returning to the issue of immersion. Still IMO, a chat window log in itself is enough to detract from the Thief experience, as in addition to the HUD estethique problem you risk the annoyance of a dozen shouting kids. In that respect, I wonder how you'd implement the policing of idiot players.

You said "While not an RPG in any respect,"... The Thief games themselves are fine examples of how CRPGs should play. Attempting to imitate or emulate Thief must take into account that roleplaying aspect. Not the stats and items and silly stuff like that, but the feeling of being there, being another character. How do you plan to preserve the immersion?

--
Larris

RavynousHunter on 3/4/2008 at 22:13

If you want better characters to have better stuff, you could implement a system kinda like in Call of Duty 4, where you get more and better equipment/mods the better you get in multiplayer.

As for tackling the death situation... There are many avenues that you could use to solve this problem... In the end, its up to you and what you feel is appropriate. As a hint, you could do some research on how death is handled in different games, to maybe help ya along a little... :erg:

jtr7 on 4/4/2008 at 02:51

I can't imagine how it would be possible to play the game with so many people filling the spaces and almost all being wise to taffers in the shadowy areas. There would be no patrol patterns to observe and plan around, nor time to stay put. How would the chaos be controlled enough to make it enjoyable as well as challenging?

If something attracted the majority of players to one small area of the entire town, while a few purposely ignored that attraction and went into the vacated areas, I could see someone making gains.

I've never played online or multiplayer stealth games, so I don't know how that's been resolved.

thiefinthedark on 5/4/2008 at 01:35

So far, my idea is thus:

To contain the naturally chaotic environment of a strictly PvP environment, i came up with the "Bounty" system. Essentially, it looks like this:

Player offense (Thieving, killing)
.
v
Seen? Unseen?
. .
. v
. No problem!
v
Seen by PC Seen by Npc
. .
v v
Unreported? Reported? -> Bounty level raised to X
.
v
No problem!

There are varying levels of penalties for the player as their bounty level increases from 1-10, and the flowchart is of course more detailed o n paper. What this does is coerce the player into doing anything that they are going to do in a very stealthy manner. Instead of just jumping around a corner and hacking away at anything that moves, they are encouraged to stake out and stalk potential targets.

Unlike thief, NPC guards won't just holler at any cloaked figure on a street. If you have a bounty level between 1 and 3(the base level given for seen killings) you are likely to just be ignored as a citizen. Once above that bounty level, the guards will have your face and stature known, however, and will likely pursue you if seen on the street.

Between bounty levels 1-9 you are imprisoned in a prison in the mountains outside of the city, and may escape through various means if ingenious and prepared enough on entry.

Once you get to bounty level 10, however, you are imprisoned and executed (perma-death) within 2 days of in-game time. A massive outside effort might free you, but you are in a high-security section and cannot break out yourself, nor contact the outside.

Player death, i think, will be handled through a combination of the "Rechargable Ressurection Jewel " i mentioned previously, and The Magpie's idea of divine intervention, on behalf of the order.

Oh, and i scaled the player population down to 400, giving 100 players for each faction, a good balance.
Now back to work on the document itself ;)

jtr7 on 5/4/2008 at 01:37

I like the penalty against unstealthy acts with a witness.:thumb:

The idea of a life energy in a world inspired by Thief which is full of necromantic energy is nice.

thiefinthedark on 5/4/2008 at 01:58

I'm toying with ideas of incorporating social stealth ala a mix of Dark Messiah and TF2's spy camouflage abilities, allowing players to sneak into opposing factions compounds and see whats up.

Forgot to mention, too, that the players who report a crime get a cash reward once the system validates that they aren't just faking a report, to give players an incentive to do so.