SubJeff on 14/8/2010 at 01:11

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You're right, it doesn't fit with any of the other hard science in the film.

SubJeff on 15/8/2010 at 09:37

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Extrapolation doesn't exist in Zylon-World, eh?

Does she specifically say that Eames altered the architecture before they enter the dream state?

SubJeff on 15/8/2010 at 10:51

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Unfortunately I don't remember the exact wording of the conversation in the snow level so it's possible I missed Eames changes being pre-dream, but I'm baffled by you guys dismissal of the idea of changing the level with the word "magic" in some pejorative way when it's a FUCKING FILM ABOUT SHARING DREAMS AND ALTERING SHIT IN THEM. This is cognitive dissonance if I ever I saw it.

Sulphur on 15/8/2010 at 20:28

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What are you guys arguing about, anyway?

The conversation that I recall was Cobb asking Ariadne if there was a direct route to cut through the labyrinth, because they were running out of time. She was reluctant to answer, but did say that Eames had made modifications to the layout - adding the air duct system for a more direct route. It isn't specifically mentioned, but I think it's implied that this was done pre-dream.

demagogue on 15/8/2010 at 21:43

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I said this in one of my long posts, but (the tl;dr version) the way I read that conversation, it was a self-referential jab by the movie that it understood it was full of all the plot-holes you all are complaining about, and in fact they're there on purpose, or rather a side-effect they knew was there to make the plot work that they consciously accepted as required.

Cobb is effectively asking Ariadne if there is any way they can cut to the climax because the dream (& the movie itself) is running out of time, and she says something effectively like "But then everyone will notice the plot holes. They won't be hidden.", and Cobb says something like "We'll have to risk that." And (not coincidentally, I have to think) then the movie itself blossoms with plot holes all over the place as it jumps through some hoops to quickly start wrapping things up.

And then this business about Eames ... It's like Eames (the producer) foresaw changes to the script that might be made, but Ariadne is the one that actually re-wrote the level on the spot to use them (both in the story & metaphorically). I.e., my interpretation is she did change the level on the spot based on the director's (Cobb's) instructions, but using material that was set up (by Eames) in advance as a contingency. Like a good producer, Eames made it possible for the story to go various ways once production got underway, depending on needs as they arose. More literally, I took it that Ariadne took out some of the maze-y parts and effectuated the duct system, although it would expose the plot holes of the whole level more.

BTW, another part of the "8 1/2" metaphor I noticed, you can read Cobb's worrying about Mal getting in the story as worries that a director may be unconsciously putting too much of himself into the movie, and Ariadne (the writer) is the one that has to keep him honest to the story as it's written, keeping his bias out. It's one reason the director doesn't want to be too involved in writing the story itself, or inadvertently re-writing things in his interpretation while directing.