Gestalt on 24/3/2006 at 06:24
Does anyone read instruction manuals anymore? I only pay any attention to them when they're either exceptionally well done (Fallout), or have a CD key on the back.
As far as continuity goes, it seems like Garrett's face changes in every cutscene it's shown in, especially the Rustmonkey ones in T3. It's been a while, but I don't think depictions of his face in TG and T2 matched up either.
Soul Shaker on 24/3/2006 at 07:34
Continuity issue problem eh? Easy answer, Looking Glass Studios made the first 3 of the series, Ion Storm, and Eidos? (i forgot) Made Deadly Shadows...
Gestalt on 24/3/2006 at 08:01
I'm talking about his face varying both throughout the series and within individual games. Besides, Rustmonkey was responsible for quite a few cutscenes in all three games.
sparhawk on 24/3/2006 at 11:00
Quote Posted by Shoshin
They didn't do it to make Garrett look cool.
HAHA! THAT really gave me a good laugh! :joke:
Soul Shaker on 24/3/2006 at 12:46
For those who don't understand how losing an eye could make a huge scar, well, he had to have a mechanical eye put into his head ya know...so, cutting a bit of flesh open around his eye would make sense...
Quote Posted by Gestalt
I'm talking about his face varying both throughout the series and within individual games. Besides, Rustmonkey was responsible for quite a few cutscenes in all three games.
I think it's more advancement of the graphics engine if anything, or aging. Though, that also depends on how much the face changes...
Thief 2 he looks like he's about 20, DS, he looks like he's about 40...though i don't think 20 years have passed...
BlackCapedManX on 24/3/2006 at 13:34
Quote Posted by New Horizon
The scar provides no additional back story for the mechanical eye. No more than if there were no scar at all. The player is still left wondering why Garrett has a mechanical eye. I'm sure if there were absolutely no scar, they wouldn't sit there blinking and wondering...how the hell did that get in there? The would have to assume his real eye was removed somehow...either by force or choice. The scar is supposed to explain how Garrett got the mechanical eye? Nonsense. The scar is misleading to the player, because the actual event was not as violent as the scar depicts.
The scar doesn't need to provide backstory. If players want that, they can play the previous games (a subtle way to get players intersted in "dead" games, instead of just handing them everything). It's not about explaining why/how Garret has a mechanical eye. It's about why he doesn't have a normal one. In T2 (which I played without having played T1) I was confused as all hell the first time I pulled out the bow and "zoomed" in. I was thinking maybe it was supposed to simulate him focusing on a target (similarly Rainbow6, where "zooming" with unscoped weapons still got you an optic zoom, like you moved your head further down the barrel or something). Latter there was a cutscene where he tinkers with a mechanical eye, then plunks it in his face. "Oh" methinks "he's got a mechanical eye, that's why he can zoom. But wait.... why in the hell does he need a mechanical eye?" It wasn't until I came to these forums and browsed around for a while that I discovered he'd had his eye physically removed, from his face. I had no clue of this at all in T2, just that he had a mechanical eye, but there was no explanation as to whether he removed his eye so he could "zoom" or if maybe it just fell out one day while jogging home with 200 lbs of loot. But TDS sums it all up nicely with a scar and a glowing eye: he had his eye ripped out, and now he's got a mechanical one to replace it. The glowing quality pisses me off a lot more than the scar, since few other things wander around at head level in shadows glowing bright green, but I guess people in The City are just ignorant. But the scar does an adequate job of showing someone who hasn't played previous thief games that there's a reason for all this eye business, and that it isn't just magical or something.
And don't give me this "plucked out" bullshit. Kill Bill physics do not apply. That's like saying "I just, plucked out his tongue, and none of that connecting tissue to the inside of his throat came with it or anything, it was quite remarkable." Unless she made a circular sawing motion around the inside of the orbit first, there's likely to be a lot of flesh tearing going on, which would leave a scar.
OrbWeaver on 24/3/2006 at 13:50
Quote Posted by BlackCapedManX
That's like saying "I just, plucked out his tongue, and none of that connecting tissue to the inside of his throat came with it or anything, it was quite remarkable."
No, it's like saying "I plucked out his tongue and it didn't leave a large scar running across his mouth and chin", which is eminently reasonable.
BlackCapedManX on 24/3/2006 at 14:17
Only because the tongue connects further down in the thoat, the eye connects just inside the orbit, so scaring around it shouldn't be that unreasonable. Granted, a more "star" like scarring would probably be more accurate than a giant gash (indicating a sword wound), but it's not like blunt eyeball removal is some benign kind of thing.
T-Smith on 24/3/2006 at 14:26
Quote Posted by Shoshin
I get it, I do. You guys did not like Thief: Deadly Shadows. Ion Storm Warren Spector bla bla bla.
I never said that. I love Thief 3, still play it a lot. And I know New Horizon likes it to a degree (if he didn't, he wouldn't have spent so much time on Minimalist).
I was simply saying I don't like the scar. Like I said, it just doesn't make sense. I even went back and looked at some of the Thief: Gold videos to see if Garrett's face is visisble at any time after his eye is removed. It is. In the briefing of 'Strange Bedfellows', you see a close up of Garrett's face. The left side of his face is still shadowed a bit, but you can clearly see his eye is missing (there's a black hole in the socket where the eye should be) and there's no giant scar running on top or below the eye.
I get what you tried to say with the whole 'Ion Storm didn't want people to wonder' thing. You're going down the path that, if people wondered why Garrett had a mechanical eye, and they'd never played Thief 1, they'd just look at the huge scar running across his eye and assume "Oh, well someone must have slashed a sword or something at him while he was thieving." The fact is, besides the 'cool' factor, that's probably why they added it. The same reason why the game is called 'Thief: Deadly Shadows' and is missing the 3. They wanted the game to stand on it's own, and they didn't want people to bother playing the other games. Still, they could have just made a note about it someone in the game or instructions.
For all the comments about Garrett's changing face in the cinemas - that's mostly Thief 3. Remember in the first two games, we rarely ever see Garrett's face. The only time his face looks 'different' from the other times is during Viktoria's assault on Soulforge. Then in Thief 3, I dunno what was going on. Everytime a Rustmonkey cinema came on, Garrett looked different (although again, he never had a scar in any of those, not even the ones that used the in-game engine).
