Jah on 9/7/2007 at 12:32
At the end of Thief 2, I realized there was one part of the plot that I never quite understood: Why did Karras want to kill Garrett? Why was Garrett so important to him? I remember him making some references to this in his monologues during Sabotage at Soulforge, but Soulforge being by far my least favorite Thief mission, I don't remember them that well. I think there was one where he wished that he and Garrett could have been on the same side, "but that was not to be", but I can't remember the rest of it. So what was up with Karras and Garrett?
Mighty Hammer on 9/7/2007 at 13:10
Well, as Karras said, he knew that he had killed the Trickster. so I think he was afraid that Garrett could do the same to him. That's why he gave him the mechanical eye, to have him on his side. That's what I think.
BrokenArts on 9/7/2007 at 13:11
Word has it, they in fact, are really brothers.
Yandros on 9/7/2007 at 14:43
Quote Posted by Mighty Hammer
That's why he gave him the mechanical eye, to have him on his side. That's what I think.
IIRC, Garrett got the mechanical eye from the Hammers, not the Mechanists. And certainly not from Karras.
BA, I think you got it wrong:
"Garrett.... I am your FATHER!"
Cavalorn on 9/7/2007 at 15:02
Yes,Garrett got the eye from the Hammers.
Jah on 9/7/2007 at 15:02
I was also under the impression that the mechanical eye came from the Hammers, but on the other hand, I do remember one of Karras' monologues where I believe he says, like Mighty Hammer mentioned, that he (or the Mechanists in general) gave the eye to Garrett in the hopes of winning him to their side... Confusing.
It seems a bit odd to me that Karras would want to kill Garrett simply because of what happened with the Trickster. After all, Garrett didn't kill the Trickster because he likes to mess with gods and religious leaders, he did it because he was dragged into the whole affair against his will. I very much doubt Karras would have had any reason to fear Garrett if he hadn't actively invoked his wrath by trying to whack him. I suppose you could argue that Karras was somehow aware of the Keeper prophecies, realized that they referred to Garrett and tried to prevent them from coming true by having him killed, but that doesn't sound very convincing. Considering how much trouble Garrett has to go through in TDS before the Keepers let him take a peek at the prophecies, I don't see how a complete outsider like Karras would have had access to them, and even if he had, would he have believed them? This is beginning to look like a logical gap to me.
<Username> on 9/7/2007 at 15:08
Played Sabotage at Soulforge again yesterday. Karras explicitely says he made Garrett's mechanical eye in hopes of... what Mighty Hammer and Jah said.
BrokenArts on 9/7/2007 at 15:21
Quote Posted by Yandros
IIRC, Garrett got the mechanical eye from the Hammers, not the Mechanists. And certainly not from Karras.
BA, I think you got it wrong:
"Garrett.... I am your FATHER!"
lmao. That's it, that's it Yandros. ;)
Jah on 9/7/2007 at 15:29
I'm a bit fuzzy on the timeline of the Thief events, i.e. how much time had passed between TDP and TMA? In TDP, the mechanists don't seem to exist at all, in TMA, they've become a very powerful organization whose influence seems to exceed that of the Hammers. I don't think such drastic changes could take place over a period of a few months, yet I've always assumed that Garrett got the mechanical eye pretty soon after the end of TDP (I'm sure having only one eye would be a pretty serious handicap for a thief), which is why I've been under the impression that the Hammers gave him the eye to thank him for destroying the Trickster.
I assume Karras himself was also a Hammerite before he founded the Mechanist order, so theoretically he could have made the eye for Garrett on behalf of the Hammers, but that wouldn't make any sense regarding his motive of trying to win Garrett over to his (the mechanists') side. Hmm...
R Soul on 9/7/2007 at 15:42
Even if Karras had left Garrett alone, it would still have been in Garrett's interests to stop him because otherwise everyone would be dead. Knowing from T1 how dangerous a foe Garrett could be, Karras presumably wanted to strike the first blow, but underestimated Garrett's abilities.
As for the mechanical eye, I reckon when it was made the Mechanists were merely a group within the Hammerites. The split would have happened much later, once there were enough Mechanists to function independently.
