june gloom on 23/11/2009 at 19:32
Quote Posted by mothra
i only played the demo and from the beginning it was clear the buddy AI cannot handle those maps/areas unless YOU take care of the bots, not the other way around like it should be. funny since L4D seems to make so much money with so little ppl playing online (compared to sales). Valve even said a higher percentage always plays single - they should notice the bad AI, but then again, a game sold is a game sold, most customers never complain and just buy so who is Valve to argue with their customers. they started out as the "good guys" but over time they discovered the low standards of their customers if they just have ENOUGH customers to compensate for the "old", the "critical" ones. So now they really think gamers are whiners and not their "main" customers anymore. so why deliver the old quality ?
see IW.net
What the fuck are you talking about?
EvaUnit02 on 23/11/2009 at 19:36
Mothra, it's not Valve's fault if the majority of their customers aren't playing the fucking game properly. HURR DURR, I'LL PLAY THIS GAME DESIGNED AROUND MULTIPLAYER BY MYSELF.
There's plenty of SP games with a half-arsed, tacked on MP component, L4D is the other way around.
june gloom on 23/11/2009 at 19:38
I must admit I'm a bit disappointed in the AI this time around.
gunsmoke on 23/11/2009 at 19:47
Quote Posted by EvaUnit02
Mothra, it's not Valve's fault if the majority of their customers aren't playing the fucking game properly. HURR DURR, I'LL PLAY THIS GAME DESIGNED AROUND MULTIPLAYER BY MYSELF.
There's plenty of SP games with a half-arsed, tacked on MP component, L4D is the other way around.
Hmmm. Playing it properly? Don't get me wrong, I get your point, but single-player is a valid game type and should be a lot 'tighter' than the condition it shipped in. Customers' complaints towards the bots' A.I. is certainly justifiable.
Assidragon on 23/11/2009 at 20:53
Quote Posted by dethtoll
I must admit I'm a bit disappointed in the AI this time around.
There's an analysis of the bot behaviour on the steam forums, basically saying it didn't get worse, just... changed.
(
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1038221)
It's somewhat interesting. Apparently they were trying to force people rely on the bots less. :erg: Which is somewhat weird given that the bots weren't so useful in L4D either. Though if they just made the bots stick closer to me, it'd be a great improvement already.
At any rate, the game feels solid to me, with some odd bugs that I have no idea why they can't fix (starting with the ungodly ping at the beginning of each map that slowly goes down as time passes, wtf). I think it's a nice improvement over L4D1, but if I did buy the first game, I might be pissed as it's more of an expansion-pack style improvement instead of a brand new game.
One thing that really annoys me is that they promised more light on the backstory this time around. If they DID put some in there, I must've missed them...
Angel Dust on 23/11/2009 at 21:47
I've played through 3.5 campaigns and I fucking love it. It's exactly what a sequel* (to a good game) should be, it takes what was great about the original and really ups the ante. The campaigns are linked so there is a little bit of a story running through them and they are so much better than the ones in the original (packed with detail and more variation, in both look and events) that I don't know if I could play the old ones anymore.
I will say though that anyone who is looking to play it solely as a single-player should not bother unless you don't mind playing on easy. The bot AI is simply not up to the task of the new climax events. It's a shame but L4D was never meant to be a single-player game (indeed I was never interested in it initially because all marketing/previews stressed this to a huge degree. Then I played it :)). However as you can't always find 3 other people to play with the AI should certainly be able to cope better than it does.
Also I haven't seen much in the way of dynamic weather in any of the campaigns, with the exception of Hard Rain of course (fighting a tank in a heavy, blustery storm is not one I'll forget!), and that's a little disappointing. I haven't played that much though so maybe I just haven't encountered that yet.
*Note: This doesn't mean that I don't think that L4D1 could have done with some more DLC. It could, and I hope it gets it, but L4D2 is a full-fledged game in it's own right; it ain't no expansion pack.
Wormrat on 23/11/2009 at 22:01
I've only played the demo, but I didn't have much trouble beating it on advanced with only bot "help." Are the other levels in the campaign really that bad? I had intended to do an SP run to familiarize myself with everything before joining other humans.
Assidragon on 23/11/2009 at 23:42
Well, if this certifies for an answer: I do expect some areas to get toned down by later patches. Right now some can't be made unless you're in a good team and/or get lucky... and with bots, some of the finales are simply excruciatingly painful. :sweat:
Angel Dust on 24/11/2009 at 00:10
Quote Posted by Wormrat
I've only played the demo, but I didn't have much trouble beating it on advanced with only bot "help." Are the other levels in the campaign really that bad? I had intended to do an SP run to familiarize myself with everything before joining other humans.
The full game is much harder than the demo. This was the same for L4D1 as well and it seems that Valve tone down the AI Director for the demos.
Nameless Voice on 25/11/2009 at 01:51
Quote Posted by Assidragon
One thing that really annoys me is that they promised more light on the backstory this time around. If they DID put some in there, I must've missed them...
Valve.
