massimilianogoi on 9/4/2009 at 10:34
Here's my second technical opened thread in the general discussion forum, after the one of the servants, to better understand the mechanists thought, to write better details on my FM.
The question now is: how planned Karras to survive if he succeeded to erase the mankind and anything organic? Since human, he needed to be feed... But without plants and animals (that all depends from the plants, following the pyramidal alimentar chains) how could he go on? :wot:
PotatoGuy on 9/4/2009 at 10:42
I think we have to keep in mind that Karras is...crazy. Just crazy.
The Builder's Children could survive without food, and maybe Karras envies those robots. Maybe he even compared himself with a robot. (In the last scene of Thief2 he has something machine-like in his face.)
Secondly, maybe he thought that in the Builder's Paradise people wouldn't need food anymore. It IS a paradise, isn't it?
jtr7 on 9/4/2009 at 10:42
He was going to live long enough to make sure the major plan was accomplished, make sure the world was the way he wanted it, make sure the machines were ready to take over, and then breathe in the rust-gas and kill his flesh, expecting The Builder to look on him with favor and let him take his place at The Builder's side.
The cutscene shows the bots adjusting things on Karras and presumably would continue keeping each other fueled. With alchemy and the real existence of flammable metals, not to mention the The River flowing into the OCEAN to the south, there would be no END of food, water, or fuel, and ultimately, no flesh to need food when the plan was completed. What the sea merchants and travelers from afar and overseas would think about The Builder's Paradise is the only thing he never mentions. Maybe a Mech City and the vast devastation would keep people away for some time, as stories and rumors spread to the other towns. If the Baron and Blackbrook were far enough away having their war, what would the Baron or his troops do upon returning home?
massimilianogoi on 9/4/2009 at 10:56
Quote Posted by jtr7
He was going to live long enough to make sure the major plan was accomplished, make sure the world was the way he wanted it, make sure the machines were ready to take over, and then breathe in the rust-gas and kill his flesh, expecting The Builder to look on him with favor and let him take his place at The Builder's side.
DAMN!! This is horrible!! :eek:
Some source about? Where you readed this?
Quote Posted by jtr7
The cutscene shows the bots adjusting things on Karras and presumably would continue keeping each other fueled.
Explain better. I was knocked by that scene, and I'm always wondered how the bot do to Karras, we see his head moving a bit, like someone is detaching abruptly
Quote Posted by jtr7
With alchemy and the real existence of flammable metals, not to mention the OCEAN to the south, there would be no END of food, water, or fuel.
You mean fish as food?
jtr7 on 9/4/2009 at 11:18
Quote Posted by massimilianogoi
Quote Posted by jtr7
He was going to live long enough to make sure the major plan was accomplished, make sure the world was the way he wanted it, make sure the machines were ready to take over, and then breathe in the rust-gas and kill his flesh, expecting The Builder to look on him with favor and let him take his place at The Builder's side.
DAMN!! This is horrible!! :eek:
Some source about? Where you readed this?
[INDENT]
kar1602K: Alas, I alone must wait for purification. I must remain alive to greet The Builder, while all around me all else is cleansed by His wondrous breath. The day shall come when I, too, breathe in His perfection. My burden is heaviest now, but my rewards will be greatest...later. Praise The Builder for all His wisdom![/INDENT]
He speaks about other aspects, but that's the key one that most people miss.
Quote Posted by massimilianogoi
Quote Posted by jtr7
The cutscene shows the bots adjusting things on Karras and presumably would continue keeping each other fueled.
Explain better. I was knocked by that scene, and I'm always wondered how the bot do to Karras, we see his head moving a bit, like someone is detaching abruptly
I don't know what the bots are doing, but one is adjusting something on his helmet then lets go (as you noticed), and others are adjusting the little armatures on his uniform/suit/costume. We don't know anything about the mechanical bits of his clothing, or what changes he may have made to his body, if any, but his skin was said to have taken on a disturbing metallic appearance on one occasion.
Quote Posted by massimilianogoi
You mean fish as food?
I don't know if Karras would eat the fish, or what he's been eating all along, but sure. He let his followers eat fish (frozen with Lotus), heh heh. Also, the birds that come and eat the fish, shellfish, crabs, seaweed, anything protected by being under flowing water--and whatever stored food I was hoping to see in Soulforge, if it would even be recognizable as food, not some weird chemical.
Oh...and if somebody doesn't like the idea of alchemy and flammable metals, the flotsam and jetsam that would wash up on the shores would provide fuel, provided it was allowed to dry out, and it washed up regularly.
Petike the Taffer on 9/4/2009 at 11:56
Karrass was insane and I think he didn't bother much about the consequences of his genocide on all living things. At the end of TMA, he is fully obsessed with his Messianic complex and probably even believes to be one with the Builder, if not some human incarnation of the Builder himself !
I think that he either just didn't care... or...
...planned to convert his body with the technology used for the masked servants - but with a heavily augmented and more sophisticated version, probably replacing most of his body and organs with artificial parts...
...becoming a near-immortal cyborg, the god-like ruler of his beloved new machine race... :eek:
Sick and creepy... :erm: :wot:
massimilianogoi on 9/4/2009 at 12:28
Quote Posted by jtr7
[INDENT]
kar1602K: Alas, I alone must wait for purification. I must remain alive to greet The Builder, while all around me all else is cleansed by His wondrous breath. The day shall come when I, too, breathe in His perfection. My burden is heaviest now, but my rewards will be greatest...later. Praise The Builder for all His wisdom![/INDENT]
He speaks about other aspects, but that's the key one that most people miss.
This does not means that Karras would have suicided himself... Maybe he meant only that he should have lived (breathed then) beside the Builder.
And...
Quote Posted by massimilianogoi
Explain better. I was knocked by that scene, and I'm always wondered how the bot do to Karras, we see his head moving a bit, like someone is detaching abruptly
Please forgive my grammatical errors, sometime I write in english so fast as it would be my native language, but isn't, then I commit some error.. I meant "I was always wondering how the bot do to Karras. we see his head moving a bit, like something is detached abruptly"
Quote Posted by jtr7
... We don't know anything about the mechanical bits of his clothing, or what changes he may have made to his body, if any, but his skin was said to have taken on a disturbing metallic appearance on one occasion.
Quote Posted by jtr7
... Also, the birds that come and eat the fish, shellfish, crabs, seaweed, anything protected by being under flowing water--and whatever stored food I was hoping to see in Soulforge, if it would even be recognizable as food, not some weird chemical.
The birds... under flowing waters??
Quote Posted by jtr7
Oh...and if somebody doesn't like the idea of alchemy and flammable metals, the flotsam and jetsam that would wash up on the shores would provide fuel, provided it was allowed to dry out, and it washed up regularly.
I agree to this idea, even in the real life flammable metal exists. I remember when I was 14 years ago at the college, in the laboratory they showed to us a piece of pure potassium, they inserted in the water, and suddendly the metal did a violen reaction, burning.. I think also the moisture used as propellent for the rockets has some metal inside.
Herr_Garrett on 9/4/2009 at 12:42
Quote Posted by Petike the Taffer
Karrass was insane and I think he didn't bother much about the consequences of his genocide on all living things. At the end of TMA, he is fully obsessed with his Messianic complex and probably even believes to be one with the Builder, if not some human incarnation of the Builder himself !
I think that he either just didn't care... or...
...planned to convert his body with the technology used for the masked servants - but with a heavily augmented and more sophisticated version, probably replacing most of his body and organs with artificial parts...
...becoming a near-immortal cyborg, the god-like ruler of his beloved new machine race... :eek:
Sick and creepy... :erm: :wot:
Agreed. But that's what's going to happen with mankind, too. But by that time, thank gods, I'll be long dead.
Anyway, maybe the bot was caressing Karras? Haha! caress-Karras... Whatever.
Actually, I agree with jtr7. I guess he thought himself a sort of sacrifice-saviour, who brings about the Builder's Paradise by his own sacrifice (that he'll be the last to die). What is more interesting, what did he think would happen with the souls of the dead? Jason, any clue about that?
Because if the material world is roaming with Bots, then the souls must go somewhere.
Quote:
Originally posted by jtr7What the sea merchants and travelers from afar and overseas would think about The Builder's Paradise is the only thing he never mentions. Maybe a Mech City and the vast devastation would keep people away for some time, as stories and rumors spread to the other towns. If the Baron and Blackbrook were far enough away having their war, what would the Baron or his troops do upon returning home?
Well, the rust gas would have destroyed the whole world, wouldn't it? It feeds upon organic material and thus reproduces itself. That
means the whole world (except the rocks itself and water).
Poesta on 9/4/2009 at 13:58
Herr_garett has a point. Unless there is absolutely no plant life outside the city (e.g. the city is located on an island) the rust gas will spread further.
Karras wanted to sacrifice himself after his business was done, but he couldn't go long without food. But with the Builder's efficiency, he built two of those little campsite fridges and put them in his office. (
http://jayb.ath.cx/Soulforge/Karras_Buero_12.jpg) See?
massimilianogoi on 9/4/2009 at 15:11
hahaha :laff:
