Selete on 13/12/2007 at 18:25
Yes, that's right. Thief is (possibly) helping my progress toward getting my degree. Or it will, if I can figure out how to get easy access to his quotes.
The idea is to compare him to the Dostoevsky's 'Grand Inquisitor,' if you were wondering. The two are complete opposites. The Grand Inquisitor is a heretic church member who covertly leads the people away from genuine religious worship by giving them a comfortable pseudoreligion with no real basis (he stops the second coming of Jesus to do this.) Karras... well, you all know what he did, and I'm not certain if anyone else is interested (though it makes me giddy, personally. :cheeky: )
Anyway, I was wondering if anyone could tell me how to get books and voice files out of the game so I could hear his quotes without having to sit around Soulforge with a pencil and paper, waiting for him to say something... fun for me, but the paper is due too soon for that.
Thank you so much for your help!
SlyFoxx on 13/12/2007 at 20:04
That's easy.
Go to your T2 install and find the folder named RES.
Open that and you'll see books.crf and snd.crf. Copy those somewhere and rename them book.zip and snd.zip. Unzip and have at it. Do the same to the other crf files if you want to poke around in them.
jtr7 on 13/12/2007 at 20:33
Easiest:
I highly recommend you listen to the ones you like, so you can get the emphasis.
[SPOILER]kar0609a (Servant speaking) Let me go. Let me go. Someone free me [here?]-- (Karras speaking) Behold, Sheriff Truart! From the lowly street rot emerges the loyal worker. That which I call...'The Servant.' (Truart speaking) This is one of the tramps I delivered to you? The transformation is spectacular! (Karras speaking) And neither want nor worry has he. (Truart speaking) Lucky fellow! Strange you should mention worries, Karras...because I do have one....
kar0609b (Truart speaking, continued) It's not that the money's not right--no--it's just that I need to be convinced you've taken the proper precautions. The Truart name is untainted by scandal, and I will not be the one to bring it humiliation and ruin. (Karras speaking) Trust thee in me...for 'tis The Builder Himself who guides me. And the Baron...need never know. (Truart speaking) Yes...I'm glad your Builder guides you, but it would make me feel even more confident if you were to let me in on your...whole scheme.
kar0609c (Truart speaking, continued) Come now! What's the crux of it all, eh, Karras? Show me what's so special about your new Servants. (Karras speaking) Ehm...'tis impossible to hide anything from you, good Sheriff. I will give thee full explanation then in the form of...a demonstration. The visual in this instance would far surpass any...verbal elaborations I could relate. But, I must ask thee to step away from the Masked Servant. That's right. And meanwhile, I will retrieve our...'volunteer.' A most unfortunate guttersnipe who waits just outside.
kar0609d (Karras speaking, continued) Come, come, gentle beggar. And stand ye juuust there, next to the masked man. Yes. Now, all is in readiness, so keep thine eyes on the new arrival, whilst I signal the Servant...thusly....
kar0609e (Truart exclaiming) My word! The mask emits a red vapour! (Beggar Woman crying out and then screaming) Uh! Please, no! Help! (Karras speaking) Continue thy observations, Truart. (Truart exclaiming fearfully) But it consumes them! We're in peril! (Karras speaking) Fear thee not, stout Sheriff, for we are safe at this distance. See? Already the reaction ceases....
kar0609f (Truart exclaiming and observing) They're gone! And what remains in their stead? Sand? No...rust! (Karras speaking) Indeed, 'tis very much like rust, and harmless once settled. Brother Feagan, I pray thee, do sweep up...what is left of those two. (Feagan responds) Yes. (Truart exclaiming and observing) A weapon then! Quite fantastic! And...monstrous! Of course, you'll keep these Servants you're making away from me and my men? (Karras speaking) Thou need not even ask. (Truart speaking) Then, we are in agreement!
kar0609g (Truart speaking, continued) You need subjects for your Servant project, and I can supply them. Vagabonds, street scum, prostitutes...those who will not be missed by anyone of consequence. They'll be rounded up, charges invented, et cetera. Still, there's always risk. So I will give you...twenty, no more. For your part, you'll remember to keep our transactions absolutely secret! And of course, deliver my payment--in advance, in full--tomorrow. I don't trust you, Karras, so you'll receive the subjects only after I confirm the payment.
kar0609h (Truart speaking, continued) Well, our business here is finished. (Karras speaking) Yesss.... Fare thee well, Truart!
kar0610A (Karras speaking) Now see, friends...with the Builder's efficiency I have completed two tasks, with but one...effort. Firstly, I did secure twenty subjects to be transformed into Servants, as you heard. And secondly, I secured the loyalty of the wary Sheriff Truart. Yes...his loyalty...heh. Truart fears scandal. Yet his actions of late could bring him that, or worse, if ever made public.
KAR0610B You will find the safety deposit box key in the Acolytes' Quarters.
kar0610C You will find the safety deposit box key in the Guards' Quarters.
kar0610D You will find the safety deposit box key in the Office on the Second Floor of the Church.
kar0610E You will find the safety deposit box key in the Factory Area.
kar0610F You will find the safety deposit box key in the East Tower.
kar0610I You will find the safety deposit box key in the West Tower.
kar0610J You will find the safety deposit box key in the Catacombs.
kar0610K You will find the safety deposit box key at the Pulpit in the Church.
kar0610L You will find the safety deposit box key in a Closet near the Pulpit.
kar0610M You will find the safety deposit box key in the Shed atop the Acolytes' Quarters.
kar0610N You will find the safety deposit box key in the Storage Shed.
kar0610P You will find the safety deposit box key in the Kitchen.
kar0610Q You will find the safety deposit box key in the Gallery.
kar0610R You will find the safety deposit box key in the Loft.
kar0610S Now, behold, my wax cylinder machine. I've used it to capture the Sheriff's very words, even as they moved through the air, today. Hearken, friends! (Recording of Truart's words) ...And I can supply them. Vagabonds, street scum, prostitutes...those who will not be missed by anyone of consequence.... (Karras speaking) With his voice thus preserved, Truart dare not betray me or he'll have the scandal he fears so much. Brother Feagan. Thou wilt see to it that this wax cylinder machine gets safely to the bank on the morrow.
kar0611A (Karras speaking, continued) Friends...we are adjourned. Return now to your duties.
kar0611B (Karras speaking, continued) Friends...we are adjourned. Return now to your duties.
kar0611C (Karras speaking, continued) Friends...we are adjourned. Return now to your duties.
KAR1601A Thou art Garrett...are you not? So, once again we are met. And the woman of the woods--didst thou come here together?
kar1601B But lo, how easily evil is felled when the righteous hold the mace! (Chuckles) Thou art transparent to me, Garrett. Even now I can see thou seekest to stop me, but there is naught you can do.
kar1601C My chamber resists all manner of infiltrations, even from a skilled man such as thyself. The Servants hearken to my instructions only, and even now await my commands!
kar1601D Maybe I've waited overmuch. Garrett, thine intrusion has been my cue to begin now the final preparations. May the world be ready for the Builder's arrival! I fear you not, Garrett, but I have dispatched some of the Builder's Children to intercept yooou. Thou too will perish...and trouble me...no more....
kar1602A I know thou art not a believer, Garrett. Yet thou art well aware that half of all thou seest is through Mechanist machinery: Thy metal eye. I gave the eye to thee in the hopes that thou wouldst be an ally, but 'twas not to be. You have eluded me in the past, Garrett, but no one--not even thee--will escape this night.
kar1602B Why choose the side of villainy, Garrett? Why the side of the witch-woman? With you as aide my plans could have been so much further along. (Sighs as he says) Hmm, 'twould have been most advantageous.
kar1602C Nay, I shall not pine, Garrett, that thou wert no ally to me. Thou art not known for constancy...nor loyalty. 'Twas from the folly of Constantine that I learned that. Yes, I know all about thy past dealings. Why else should I concern myself with the likes of thee? I wouldst to have thee under my control, else dead! Indeed...I'd have had both.
kar1602D Long ago, I realized that heretics would never accept their roles in the coming of The Builder's paradise. I anticipated thine oppositions, Garrett...and others who wouldst try to murder me. Thus the Builder protects me. This chamber from which I speak, hmm? 'Tis His arms encircling me, and all that I need is here within. I need not emerge until the Builder's paradise has come...and you are but dust...blown upon the wind.
kar1602E Still alive, Garrett? Thou scurries about like a mouse. And for what? Why not leave this place and try to destroy each of the Servants? Oh, but there are thirty mansions, too many to infiltrate in one night? You misspend your last hours of life. 'Tis equally dignified to laze in a field and await thy death, heh.
kar1602F Twas The Builder that smote them, the Precursors. He gave them the power to bring about His Paradise, but they refused or lacked the ingenuity. The why of it is forever unknown, but 'tis clear they were punished for their failings. Their civilization was wiped away that ours could emerge, and now ours shall give way to The Builder's.
kar1602G Sifting through the remnants of the Precursors' world, I found the tools The Builder had left for me. Why save these things when all else is gone? The Builder hath spoken to Karras, and imagine my joy when finally I did piece the puzzle together! How long did it wait for one...such as me? One who could bring about the age when The Builder would walk again...on earth?
kar1602H Look about you, Garrett! I built these machines you see, and in turn they produced the Builder's children. The Necrotic Mutox, the Servants, everything! 'Tis my gift to The Builder! Soulforge Cathedral and all it contains! 'Twill be the very center of The Builder's Paradise! Surely this strikes wonder into your heart.
kar1602I Who killed that fool Truart? Was it thee? Or that woman of the woods? Truart.... It amused me to learn he'd been murdered. He was but a...bumbling pawn who thought himself king. He provided me with material to create Servants, but he was useless for stopping the Pagans! ...Or thee.
kar1602J I should offer thanks to your departing Trickster woman, for 'twas she that warned me. Before her arrival, I thought the City was blind to The Builder's Paradise I shall soon bring about. Yet 'tis just thee who knows. No matter...for even if all The City knew, still...I could not be stopped.
kar1602K Alas, I alone must wait for purification. I must remain alive to greet The Builder, while all around me all else is cleansed by His wondrous breath. The day shall come when I, too, breathe in His perfection. My burden is heaviest now, but my rewards will be greatest...later. Praise The Builder for all His wisdom!
kar1602L I know not why you oppose me. In one act I will end all human suffering, and clear the path for The Builder to walk again on earth. History will move forward. My tireless children will build in His name, creating advancements...beyond our understanding. Now is the dark time before the days of light. Why dost thou oppose me!
kar1602M Soon all will be blessed with the breath of The Builder: the Necrotic Mutox that I created. And all the souls--the rich that spurned me, the City Watch that betrayed me, the loathsome Pagans, the mindless commoners, even the loyal followers of Karras, all!--all will receive the blessing and the cleansing. But will they raise up their arms and praise Karras as the vapors make them pure? Nay! They will wail and scream--most ungrateful!
kar1602N Garrett...thou must prepare thy soul for The Builder's arrival. Cleanse thy thoughts and accept His words. Embrace the coming of The Builder's Paradise, and rejoice in the humble part...that thou hast played.
kar1602P What hast thou...built..., Garrett? When the time comes to review thy life, with The Master Builder afore thee, and the question is asked, 'What hast...thou...built,' what will thee say, poor Garrett? For thou art a man of...destruction, not...construction. 'Tis the biggest sin of all. Build thyself today a good...house! That would please Him much!
kar1602Q Who is Karras, but the Hand of The Builder? What the Builder wills, Karras...does. What the Builder wants, Karras...makes. Praise to Karras! ...And the Builder.
kar1602R (Weeping in awe of his own glory) I have built so many things! I have made Servants...f-f-from street scum! I've made towering arches from raw...ore! I have built to glorify Him that is Builder and teacher. If ever I did a thing, 'twas always...f-f-for Him. He knows this, for He knows--he knows all....
kar1602S How can mere man...conceive the gear? Nay, 'twas The Builder! He speaks it first in our waiting ears, then guides our pen when 'tis time to writ. 'Twas not Karras that conceived this plan! It was The Builder spoke it first to his ear, and guides him now during final hours.
kar1602T When I sit in judgment, the Builder afore me, and He asks, 'Karras, what hast thou built,' I will answer...thusly: 'I have built...a church for Thee, solid...and good. And also for Thee...countless structures. I have forged...minions of children, wrought innumerable tools...all in Your Name. He will be pleased, and I will take my place by His side.
kar1603A What? Thou lives still? Thou wilt not escape this time!
kar1603B Garrett! In truth I thought thou had perished already. Thou'lt soon, then!
kar1603C By The Builder, Garrett, thou wilt be crushed between gears like dry leaves underfoot!
kar1603D (Tauntingly) Garrett...thine end is nearrr. Cease thy squirmings and pray for thy very sooull....
kar1603E (Tauntungly) I see theee! And the one they called Garrett did come. A meddler was he, and trickery and stealth were his weapons. Then Karras, the Brave, did seize him! And then smote him right down...with the venom of Truth, and the mace...of the Righteous. Praaaaise Karras!
kar1603F (Tauntingly) Nay, nay! Stop thy destructions, Garrett. Thou art...not important. Thou hast not built anything...not like Karras has, hmm. I shall strike thee down for certain, this time....
kar1603G Again, I see thee, thief! Cease thy slitherings. Be gone from here...or perish. I have important preparations to attend to.
kar1603H I am thankful that Karras was chosen to cleanse the earth...for Him. (Praying) Builder, guide me in my final preparations! Builder, fuel me...and smite mine enemies. Smite now this...bothersome nettle that I see again before me.
kar1603I Art thou not a thief? Then steal thyself away, pest! (Highly amused and chortles too much) Yes (chuckles), hurry now and steal thyself away from this most holy place, ere The Builder's Children arrive again...to smite thee certain this time.
kar1603J Seeks thee to stop me, but 'tis not to be. Thou art a lowly thief at worst, and at best, inconstant friend to the dead tree woman. I am Karras...pure...brave...and good! Now Karras must attend to his scriptures...and The Builder's Children...shall attend to thy fate....
kar1603K Seest thou my children? The Children of Karras? Are they not obedient? Are they not swift? I thank The Builder that pride is no sin, else of them sinfully proud would I be! And now, I see thee again, and I say to them, 'Go now, and fetch for the thief the violent fate he hath earned!'
karvic00 Greetings, Garrett! Thou art expected, though not precisely welcomed. Feel not so surprised. I have anticipated thine arrival, just as I now anticipate thy departure. (Laughs) Art thou a religious man? It is time to say thy prayers! Thy sins will be thine own undoing.
karvic01 (Woman speaking) Message number one of six: (Karras taps the recorder before speaking) Is this functioning? Oh. My good guests, welcome to Angelwatch! I have gathered you here, citizens of exceptional breeding, for a fine and festive evening. The Builder's work never ceases. Thus I am not able to attend in person, but I am present in heart and voice, as you can plainly hear. Friend Vilnia will be your host in my absence. Now our evening together begins.
karvic02 (Woman speaking) Message number two of six: (Karras speaking) Greetings again, guests! I pray your spirits do not suffer from my absence. I present to each...a giift: the most wondrous yet of my innovations, a living worker suited to all household tasks, ready always to perform your bidding. I call them...the 'Servants.' The Servant knows not how to lead or gossip. The Servant knows only how to tirelessly perform thy will...be it cooking, cleaning, or gardening. Pleease...accept them with my gratititude. But the tour continues. Pray, to follow Vilnia once again.
karvic03 (Woman speaking) Message number three of six: (Karras speaking) Lords and Ladies, behold The Builder's Chapel! It is here we reflect upon The Builder's great plan. The Servants I am giving thee are examples of our strivings toward His ideals. Before they were Servants, the souls behind the masks were lost and unproductive. Now they are models of efficiency. Alas, if only I could be there to share with thee the wonder of this moment! But I digress. On with the tour!
karvic04 (Woman speaking) Message number four of six: (Karras speaking, recording skipping) Privileged gue--Privileged gue--Privileged gue--Privileged gue--Privileged guests, I trust thee will enjoy this feast presented by the Servants I have given you. Imagine! A short while ago, these Servants were confined to an asylum. Mentally feeble, they were of no use to anyone. Now they are safe and productive. Now they know happiness. Would that I could be with you tonight for the Servants make excellent cooks. After you dine, Friend Vilnia will guide thee on to the Gallery.
karvic05 (Woman speaking) Message number five of six: (Karras speaking) The Builder created beauty to bring us joy, for the joyful of spirit work the longest, and in this gallery we find beauty. Fine guests, thy surely have precious works of art in thy homes. Here, too, the Servants are of use. They are completely trustworthy. At first hint of trouble, they will call for the nearest guard. Take some time to appreciate our gallery. Then, Vilnia will escort you to the Ballroom.
karvic06 (Woman speaking) Message number six of six: (Karras speaking) It is here that our evening ends. Enjoy thee the music and dance if thou wilst. On the morrow, when thou dost return home, your Servant will be waiting for thee. Yes, they travel on their own! Indeed, on occasion they will leave your homes in response to a device I call 'the Guiding Beacon,' and return to us for but small adjustments. Upon their return to your homes, better Servants they'll be. I apologize yet again for my absence tonight, noble friends. Fare thee well![/SPOILER]
Zillameth on 13/12/2007 at 21:34
Be careful with Karras. He sounds philosophical, but there are obvious missteps in his reasoning (because, as we know, he's mad). As far as I can tell, my grasp of philosophy being fairly basic, this reduces the value of his thoughts to nil.
I've always perceived Karras and all Mechanists as a kind of follow-up to the Hammerites. Hammer texts present a draft of a "real" philosophy - a consistent system of values and symbols. Even the tenets follow a certain train of thought provided by this system. TMA shows how this system is warped into its own contradiction by an ill mind. It also illustrates how the rhetoric replaces the philosophy, when followers no longer recognize values represented by symbols (that is, they no longer understand what those symbols "really" mean).
For example, the Hammerites talk a lot about hammers, they even say things like "blessed be the hammer" and such. In their philosophy, hammer is an alegory - it represents honest work, justice, and, most importantly, their faith. So when they say "blessed be the hammer", they really mean "we value honest work, and we worship the Builder". Mechanists get it all wrong, because they take the tenets at face value. When they say "blessed be the cog and the boiler", they literally mean that cogs and boilers are holy. I don't think their set of beliefs can be called a philosophy, because it quickly reduces itself to absurd. For instance, because cogs and boilers are holy, and all that is organic is inferior, then the Mechanist paradise consists of machines only, therefore it cannot sustain itself. [SPOILER] TMA ending cutscene shows how quickly the machines at Soulforge cease to work, in spite of their immunity to rust gas. They worked for as long as humans cared for them, and when there were no more humans around, they just stopped. [/SPOILER] The Mechanists must have realised this, because they had to maintain their machines on a daily basis. But, in their way of thinking, to say "Builder's Children cannot exist without us" would be a heresy.
jtr7 on 13/12/2007 at 23:51
Quote:
I've always perceived Karras and all Mechanists as a kind of follow-up to the Hammerites.
You mean, besides the fact they are a group splintered off from the Hammers?
Really, Karras is a mad genius, who gets crazier and crazier and even more egocentric as the story progresses, until he begans to equate himself with The Builder (subtly and overtly), and even famously reducing The Builder to an afterthought.
Zillameth on 14/12/2007 at 03:18
Quote Posted by jtr7
You mean, besides the fact they are a group splintered off from the Hammers?
Yes, I mostly meant Mechanists as a kind of narrative device. The story told by their writings is a follow-up, as opposed to them being something completely new.
Quote:
Really, Karras is a mad genius, who gets crazier and crazier and even more egocentric as the story progresses, until he begans to equate himself with The Builder (subtly and overtly), and even famously reducing The Builder to an afterthought.
Well, yes, obviously. That's one of reasons why it's risky to talk about Karras' views in philosophical terms, without putting them in context of other views expressed in TDP or TMA, and Hammerite tenets in particular.
jtr7 on 14/12/2007 at 03:55
:thumb:
DJ Riff on 14/12/2007 at 11:20
Quote:
I've always perceived Karras and all Mechanists as a kind of follow-up to the Hammerites.
Yep. Hammerites are as deadly as Pagans if they gain superiority. To keep the balance is the only way to survive.
Quote:
Hammerite Compendium of Precepts, Regimens and Rules of Conduct, Vol. 77
What is a tree but a tower that withers and dies?
What is a pond but a cistern that stagnates and fills with muck?
What is a patch of ground but a road which cracks and washes away?
It's a Hammerite book, not Mechanist's.
Beleg Cúthalion on 14/12/2007 at 12:39
But there is another Hammerite saying that everything depends on what you make of it, something like: "Even a tree can become the house of the builder and a sword of steel can be used to spread chaos." Source, jtr? :p
Cobra on 14/12/2007 at 18:26
I'd strongly recommend another character besides Karras to compare the Grand Inquisitor to. The latter was crafted by one of the finest writers in the history of human endeavour, and, with all due respect to the TMA writers, Karras isn't in the same league. I don't think there is sufficient depth to his character for you to run very far with the paper - there simply must be other people in literature whom have more meat on them to explore. That's before any prejudice people (namely, whoever marks your paper) might have towards using examples in video games for serious academic work.
Regards.
P.S. I did do some philosophy, although my formal study stopped just short of university level (my amateur studies do still continue, though.) Then again, philosophy of religion wasn't my area of focus, so I can't speak with any authority on the field, but I still think there must be examples, somewhere, of a character like Karras but more academically respectable..
