june gloom on 21/7/2012 at 19:10
Hot on the heels of TDKR is the upcoming Zack Snyder film Man of Steel.
From what I understand, it's not a sequel to the mediocre Superman film from a few years back, but a straight reboot, written by the same guy who did Nolan's Batman movies, David Goyer.
(
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGEuJS98wGo) Trailer.
Growing up I was a big Superman fan, though we were
dirt poor and I couldn't afford the comics, so I had to settle for things like video games once a year. After reading a Knightquest comic at precisely the wrong time in my life I was turned off on superhero comics for a long time, including Supes. (Batman Begins got me back into it.) Watching this trailer makes me feel like a kid again. As an adult I'm hoping Zack Snyder can deliver, but as a kid I'm beyond giving a shit.
Also, I'm given to understand Lex Luthor isn't in this movie, which is good because fuck that guy. Most overrated villain ever.
Fafhrd on 21/7/2012 at 21:02
Zach Snyder can't deliver. It's going to suck for the opposite reasons that Superman Returns is unfairly maligned.
Where Returns was pretty much all heart and little action, Man of Steel is going to be all flash and no substance. But Snyder is going to lift shots and motifs and even the score from other, much more talented film makers to give a surface sheen of depth because he lacks any understanding of why those things worked in those other films.
But Superman and Zod's speedramped fisticuffs will sure look cool.
Chimpy Chompy on 21/7/2012 at 23:03
Faf I see your point about heart. But given a Superman movie I kinda want Super-villains, not a normal human with real estate obsessions. Who needs the Magic Key that turns off supermans powers to actually work as a villain.
Kuuso on 22/7/2012 at 13:51
It's no surprise they haven't come up with anything good with Superman, because it's a horribly dull character that's blatant americanism is harder to tone down for modern audiences. I don't think this will be anything better.
fett on 22/7/2012 at 15:39
I used to think that. Watched a few seasons of Smallville a few years back and was thoroughly convinced that Superman has always suffered from really shitty writers, excepting the 50's-60's era originals. That show was not much more than a teen soap-opera, but it at least demonstrated that a god living among mortals faces all types of struggles and dangers. The whole secret identity issue has been largely treated as a joke source or irrelevant, when it is actually the crux of the story. That, and the fact that although Superman has these great powers, the main pressure he feels to use them for good is that his dead father commanded him to. Add to that his inability to truly relate to mortals, his feelings of inadequacy both romantically and socially, and the question of his questionable responsibility to humanity, there is a lot of depth to explore. The action sequences would be welcome and have more heart if someone would actually explore Luther's character beyond "hur hur I want to rule the world" - he has a very personal vendetta against Superman, and deserves more depth than what Gene Hackman gave him back in the 80's. Again, the Smallville character was compelling, if non-canonical and overdone. Hell, I thought Captain America was one of the more interesting hero films of late. If they can tone down the blind patriotism for him, Superman should be a cinch.
That said, if it's the same guy that directed Watchmen (?) I wouldn't expect much.
june gloom on 22/7/2012 at 22:37
What the fuck? Blatant Americanism? Frank Miller aside -- and with Frank Miller, that Supes is reduced to a symbol is a deconstruction in itself -- that's really not a frequent theme in the comics. Much like on Smallville, Supes is often deconstructed -- for example, he's often struggling with his own strength, afraid to really let loose.
[video=youtube;etPYl1OQoqk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etPYl1OQoqk[/video]
He's more than just Superman the Man of Steel or Clark Kent the mild-mannered newspaper reporter, behind it all he's Clark Kent from Kansas. He has feelings, emotions, conflicts, and flaws, same as anyone else. He put on the cape not because he wanted to be Superman, a symbol, an ideal, but because he wanted to use his powers for good. In contrast, Batman
was meant to be a symbol, something to strike fear into the hearts of criminals.
It's why he's constantly arguing with Batman over his methods -- he and Bats are two sides of the same coin. They both want justice, but Superman had parents -- good, loving, hard-working people who bore no ill-will towards anyone, even people you might expect the average Kansan to dislike -- to instill that justice in him; Batman had none, and has waged a decades-long war of revenge against crime because he's still the same person he was five minutes after his parents were shot. That's why Supes swoops in to grab the bad guys and drag them away, and it's why Bats swoops in and punches them in the face. It's why Clark wears no mask even when he's got the cape; and it's why Bruce
is the mask, and the cowl is Batman's true face.
Inline Image:
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lp03r9NLjx1qm19too1_500.jpgConsider the Eradicator, aka Last Son of Krypton. During the Death of Superman story arc, four new supermen showed up to replace Clark. One of these was the Eradicator, who looked very much like Superman, but had a different costume and wore a visor to protect his eyes from the sun -- the same sun that gives Supes his powers. Eventually it's revealed that he's an ancient Kryptonian weapon, operating on cold, hard logic. Following the death of Superman he took up the mantle, but he was an anti-hero, more like Batman than Superman. And he killed bad guys.
Killed them. Not even Batman does that. To him, that was justice, fair punishment. The Metropolis PD hated him for it, and Guy Gardner, the Asshole Lantern, loved him for it. It's all a very right-wing idea of justice. It took him a while to realize that's not how Superman operated, and that his cold logic wasn't enough, he had to show compassion, too. And in the end, he sacrificed himself to protect the real, resurrected Superman, and in the process gave the weakened Clark his powers again, a far cry from his first appearance where he kills a homeless serial carjacker.
So yeah, sure, Superman is often held up as an ideal, as a shining symbol of justice and fairness and doing the right thing -- but are you seriously telling me those are uniquely American ideals?
Inline Image:
http://mondoweiss.net/images/2011/05/ActionComics-US-citizenship.jpgVolitions Advocate on 23/7/2012 at 07:48
This video pretty much sums up how I feel about supes:
(
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PlwDbSYicM)
Although I did just finish reading Red Son, A take on what would happen if he landed 12 hours later in the Ukraine and Superman was a soviet. Very good read. I recommend it.
SubJeff on 23/7/2012 at 08:21
Quote Posted by dethtoll
What the fuck? Blatant Americanism?
So yeah, sure, Superman is often held up as an ideal, as a shining symbol of justice and fairness and doing the right thing -- but are you seriously telling me those are uniquely American ideals?
Given, if you read the comics you know there is much, much more to it than that.
But certainly here (the UK) if you ask the average person about Superman they do have that opinion and it's almost entirely based on the portrayal in the original Richard Donner film and its sequels. And the recent Brandon Routh effort. These films have a lot of American and Christian symbolism in them and so, fairly or not, are viewed by many through an Americanism lens.
Part of the justice and fairness that Superman displays is, unlike Batman, very much in line with what the authorities/The Man wants. One could argue that Lex Luthor (in the Donner series) doesn't just represent criminality but also rebellion against The Man.
But meh, I want to see this Man of Steel effort too and I did enjoy the trailer (which I saw before TKDR).
No superhero film is going to come close to what Nolan has done with Batman though. Yeah, I've enjoyed some of the other superhero films but cripes people have their work cut out. They'll want to reboot Batman again eventually. Good luck with that whoever takes it on but I'm telling you now your film(s) suck in comparison to the Nolan ones whatever you do.
Morte on 23/7/2012 at 16:43
RE: Blatant Americanism, the Superman radio show opened with this:
Quote:
Yes, it's Superman, strange visitor from another planet, with powers and abilities far beyond those of mortal men! Superman, who can change the course of mighty rivers, bend steel with his bare hands, and who, disguised as Clark Kent, mild-mannered reporter for a great metropolitan newspaper, fights a never-ending battle for truth, justice and the American way!
turning "truth, justice and the American way" into his catchphrase.
Anyway, I have to say I really like the apparently Mallick-inspired imagery in that trailer -- the (
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zld8i2mRxb0) Russell Crowe voiceover is better though -- but considering Snyder is such an awful storyteller I have zero expectation that it'll turn out good. But who knows, maybe the reaction to Sucker Punch caused him to take a long, hard look in the mirror and focus less on speed-ramp visual gimmickry and more on the basics.
june gloom on 23/7/2012 at 19:41
When the radio show began, "the American way" was not part of the intro. That was added later, during World War 2, which makes sense, doesn't it?
And anyway, when I'm talking about Superman, I'm talking about the god damn Superman from the god damn comics. Radio? The 50s TV show? The shitty 60s/70s movies? That's all Golden/Silver Age bullshit, at the height of World War 2 and the Cold War. I don't care if that's what other peoples' perceptions of Superman comes from, it's irrelevant. The Superman they based that off of no longer exists.
It's true that Superman is an American cultural icon. Let's face it, Superman was invented by a couple of Jewish guys during the Depression while the Nazis were stomping around Germany gearing up for war. Goebbels even denounced Superman as Jewish propaganda. Silver Age Supes grew grossly OP while America was stocking up nukes to take on the Russkies. We're talking about a guy who can chain planets together and drag them all through space.
But being an American cultural icon is not the fucking same thing as "blatant Americanism." He talks about America because he's an American, and was raised by patriots -- real patriots, not these jingoistic nationalist bastards running the Tea Party on a platform of hate and fear. But while Smallville, Kansas is his adopted hometown, he's got an entire damn adopted planet that he looks after. Truth, justice, and the American way -- when Supes is written well, he understands those principles to be in exactly that order. The Cold War is over, and America's "protector" no longer ignores the rest of the world -- especially not when there's so many non-Americans working for DC anyway!
