jolynsbass on 8/12/2008 at 04:56
Quote Posted by openthief
Here is a small test I have made in few hours.
If you have a good memory, you will recognized an old Thief 1 guard (from Looking Glass), to prove I did it for some sceptic people here.
Actually, I am so excited, that I will definitely help the next lead coder. I dont know when I will sleep, but I would be ready to do AI, GUI, and level editor stuff. Please advice : openthief @ hotmail.com
Kisses to everybody.
(
http://openthief.sourceforge.net/openthiefenginetest.wmv) http://openthief.sourceforge.net/openthiefenginetest.wmv
or
(
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SgZLWn6McPQ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SgZLWn6McPQ
Now, *that* lends you a great deal more credibility than anything, and I mean anything, you have said or done thus far. Instead of the basic and generally ridiculous statement of : "I want to have an open source thief project for thiefy goodness - who wants to make it for me?", you've actually gone ahead and done some real work, and have something to show! Good for you!
While I still disagree with you about TDM, at least I no longer doubt that you are even a programmer at all. Your work shows that you can indeed write code, and even that simple video you made is so much better than an empty sourceforge project page.
RavynousHunter on 8/12/2008 at 05:51
Quote Posted by openthief
Reply to ravynousHunter
If you cant consider the project without a demo or video, open thief is not for you. Just think that all the games you are playing starting from almost nothing when they started. Now an example of proof openThief is a solution : "BZFlag". Probaly around 9 years of life, full open source (no IDSoftware). Now, my resume is not important for this discussion as I dont plan to code a lot on openThief, as I said in the first topic.
I never said anything about a demo or video. I said "proof," apparently you are confused by my choice of words; so let me rephrase. I mean that I wouldn't have considered it at all because there was no proof that you had actually
done anything on it aside from
naming it and a few other ideas. I'm not an idiot, you ARE speaking to a fellow programmer here, I know that most software (games notwithstanding) starts as more or less nothing.
Still, I haven't seen a single line of source code, so I am still somewhat skeptical, but that may just be the result of seeing how easily one can be fooled when it comes to technology. At least the video adds a little more credence to your claims, but your other statements are either extremely biased or just waaaaaaay off.
The thing that gets under my skin the most is your stating that a mod isn't a long-term solution to an engine's success. Did you forget Counter Strike? It, much in the way of the Dark Mod, started out as a mod (for HL2), but then went on to be one of the most popular online FPS's of all time; so it has already happened once, and it can, and will happen again.
I can understand that you don't plan to code "a lot" on openThief, such a project is a rather large undertaking, even if you metaphorically get your engine for $3.50 down at the local thrift store. However, you hadn't, until recently, shown
any work aside from an empty SourceForge page.
sNeaksieGarrett on 8/12/2008 at 07:00
I just want to say without going into too much detail right now, that when you claim something on the internet, you better be prepared for people like us (especially TTLG :P) to be skeptical. You can't just come in here and expect us to believe your claims without proof. We only asked for a "resume" because we wanted to see that you are not making shit up. Secondly, the thing that bothers me is how you continuously point out the negative aspects of mods, etcetera. For the love of god, WE KNOW. The thing is, most of us don't give a crap. We aren't fools, we just happen to think the dark mod is cool - and another thing. When the source code comes out, New Horizon and the team can modify it. Yes, I know doom 3 is becoming old and outdated. Let me reiterate. I don't care, I don't think many other people do either. We're living in the now. I have been quite impressed with the dark mod, and I don't question the team's choice to use doom 3. Look, the thing is, a mod might be made for a 10 year old engine (like half-life) and while it may be an outdated engine, the fans of the game might still paly it. Look at Counter-strike. That game is still played like crazy even today, as far as I know.
Volca on 8/12/2008 at 07:23
Quote Posted by openthief
Reply to Volca :
you said I was sceptic when I told 2 years old life for TDM. It simply means you are aware that it is a temporay project. If the Doom3 code si released, yes some peoples will retouch it. But no there wont be Doom3 eternal life as you said. Not sure we will see new shadows technique. Is is deep hard work and should perhaps need to reorganize structure.
You say you hope openThief will die. How sad are you. See. I will be much more intelligent and nice. I definitely dont hope OPDE will die just to be sure to be able to get/convert all the Fan Mission levels nd reload it by any project which could. I hope too we will be able to play those levels with OPDE, but I doubt it will arrive as closed to this point. Actually, having a lot of code at start is not a good idea for a long term team project. Now it is effectively hard to find a new admin for openThief when people like you and Newhorizon come just for spiting out on the project, just to assure the success of their personnal project. Is is disloyal and bad. If you dont like the idea of openThief and are afraid of concurrency, please let me search for the guy with fair play.
Regards
Please point out where exactly I did say "I hope openThief will die". I thought I explained it nicely and without disrespect, maybe I'm not terribly excellent at English so I understand you could understand something different. Please quote that remark that led you to believe I stand in such position.
Also, I was trying to explain to you why people are sceptical. It is hard to start a new project, and I certainly didn't try to express absurdly negative feelings and make it even worse for you. If you'd like to try continuing with the project of yours, please do go on. Show some progress, people will start showing interest. I said this before, and am saying it now again.
I'm not afraid of concurrency, I assure you. Everything constructive happening in the Thief universe is positive.
As you feel that my reactions block your effort to find a new project admin, I won't stand in the way any longer, and from now on this thread will be read only for me, unless you'll request my reaction or insult me ;)
jtr7 on 8/12/2008 at 08:29
openthief: If you make an engine and editor that can be used to create a convincing
Thief game, then I will be happy. I don't care how superior or long-lasting your project will be IF it does not capture what I love about
Thief. I want to see many engines, mods, new, open-sourced, etc. I want options, and so do the Thief fans. I want to see my fellow fans enjoying
Thief in whatever way they can get it. I don't have to like their project. I don't have a resumé and I don't want to see your resumé. I asked for your name. I've never asked for your resumé. I'm not interested in your entire career or skills or education. and I believe you know that. Thanks for sharing your videos, but you have convinced me that I have no interest in your work, or your pouty, insulting, juvenile character. :angel:
Show us what you've got and let the work advertise itself. Stop typing so much and creating drama out of so little.
I cannot be certain, but did you say you cannot give your name because Ubisoft will claim--I'm guessing--your work for themselves, or what? "Claim" what? Are you using company equipment and/or time on a project you will only share in secret, not with the community? Considering we've had over 40 gaming company employees who weren't afraid to tell us their names and share lots of behind-the-scenes information, I wonder at your secrecy.
Quote Posted by openthief
If you have a good memory, you will recognized an old Thief 1 guard (from Looking Glass), to prove I did it for some sceptic people here.
Why would we need a good memory for something many of us see on a weekly basis? Are you implying we haven't seen Thief 1 guards recently, because you think it's a game we only played a long time ago?
Anyway, this is an open community where most of the talent is welcome to lend a hand, there are few secrets kept from those who want to help regarding the job they're willing to do, with many projects going--some complete, some mostly complete, some well on the way, some just started--and your project seems pretty closed off to us. You have proven to be difficult to work with, communicate with, and a person of words as empty as your wiki pages. You offer a dream that no one denies is a worthy cause, yet insult those who've put in thousands of hours of effort that have given the
Thief fan community great joy, even now, and for a decade, and well into the future. We don't have any doubts among us that there will be more projects to come, to keep
Thief alive. The doubt is all yours, and your inexplicable defensiveness has harmed your claims, not ours. Um, лъжец?
Baal on 8/12/2008 at 12:19
There are some standalone titles based on the Quake 3 engine like, for example, OpenArena or Tremolous. As far as I know these don't depend in any way on Quake 3 and are fully open source. So most likely the same will be possible with the Doom 3 engine.
It is also a bit late for your criticism of The Dark Mod since it is so far along in development. There is so much work done that predicting its death is a little insulting to the creators. This could also possibly benefit other projects, like yours for example (textures, sounds, maybe code).
The demonstration video was nice but nobody said anything against OGRE or Bullet.
Displacer on 8/12/2008 at 12:58
Ok, lets just get a straight answer, no yelling or flaming. You want to turn the project over to someone else, so what exactly is it? A code based project that we can't seem to find the code to, or just a concept? If you want someone to take it over, or perhaps merge it into another project then we have to know just exactly what it is.
sparhawk on 8/12/2008 at 14:04
Quote Posted by openthief
On the contrary, it is a more intelligent project than DarkMod or thief UT mod, as the graphics engine for example, is external (Ogre if I remember right).
You must be really desperate for attention if you stoop so low to slag off the efforts of other teams. :grr:
There is so much deliberate missinformation in that posting, that it's quite pointless to say more. NH already adressed it anyway.
sparhawk on 8/12/2008 at 14:39
Quote Posted by openthief
Here it is you continue to lie to our community. The Doom3 rendering engine is already less efficient than Ogre. Say the contrary. Have you tried the Ogre shadows demo ?
Well, that's really sweet if you can run an Ogre demo, but what's that got to do with Thief? Nothing? Anybody can run a demo of a graphics engine. That doesn't make progress on any Thief project though. If you compare the efficiency of Doom 3 for rendering Thief style maps and Ogre for the same task, it seems that Doom 3 is winning hands down, because Doom 3 already renders several playable maps, while Ogre is still at what? Zero!
I don't know if Volca uses Ogre for his engine, so it might be more. Anyway. The point is that a kewl new 3771 engine that can run the latest shader technology doesn't creat any new Thief levels. It's a team that does it, which you apparently don't have. So far it's all hot air and insulting from you, Mr. Wanna-be-Ubi-Coder.
Quote:
To finish, it is obvious that ID release the code which is too old and too difficult to enhance.
Apparently you have never programmed, much less looked at the Doom 3 code. Or maybe you are part of Carmacks team that you know what the code of the engine looks like?
Quote:
Your presence is welcome if you can make effort to admit some of the truth I have recalled and to have constructive words.
Which truth was it again?
Quote Posted by openthief
(is there fluids in Doom3 physic engines ?).
So you apparentyl didn't even bother to look at our demos. Considering howmuch you claim to know about TDM and it's life time, that's really surprising to hear...
Quote Posted by openthief
Here is a small test I have made in few hours.
If you have a good memory, you will recognized an old Thief 1 guard (from Looking Glass), to prove I did it for some sceptic people here.
HAHA! What a great work you showed here. So you put together a short demo with nothing, which anybdoy can do who worked a little bit with that engines, and that proofes what?
You know, that really reminds me of the days back when TDM started. There were some people who really believed that making a Thief world come to live is as easy as putting a little bit of a lightgem into the D3 engine, and a few new sounds, models and textures. LOL!
qolelis on 8/12/2008 at 15:36
I think there might be a significant language-barrier at work here. If Openthief's posts are machine-translated from Bulgarian into English (and vice versa), a lot of nuances can be lost. Machines, as you may know, are not very good at understanding implicit connotations, so what wasn't at all meant as an insult could be turned into one when translated, so, please, have that in mind (true or not).
With that said:
I like the idea of the OpenThief-project (as suggested), but, as Displacer pointed out, I am not sure what it is you want to give away (or build a team around): Do you want to give us an idea? Do you want to give us the research you have done on which engines to use? Do you want to give us code or other resources?
All this is okay as long as you are true about your intentions. Wanting a resume suggests that you have something important to share. What makes your idea/project stand out from the rest? People could start their own projects around a similar idea, so you must have a very good reason for them to instead choose your idea/project. I think that people here haven't yet seen that reason, but that does not mean that they would not be willing to see it.
