DDL on 10/5/2011 at 09:03
Hah! I live right next to manchester airport and was thinking the same thing.
I liked the bit in the video talking about the "bullshit that goes from one end of the sky to the other". Yeah man: fuckinnn...clouds, man. I CALL BULLSHIT.
Queue on 10/5/2011 at 16:29
Okay, I'm going to bite. So, CCCToad, when did these "chemtrails" that you're speaking of start, and why?
gunsmoke on 10/5/2011 at 18:02
Quote Posted by CCCToad
What if I told you that chemtrails are real and that I've seen them?
I used to live in Dayton, OH. Maybe you've heard of our famous Air Force Base? Wright-Patt? There are an awful lot of people that work there that say those damn Chemtrails are real. I dunno. I haven't made up my mind yet.
demagogue on 10/5/2011 at 18:59
I was noticing the area around DC feels like it has about 20 times more contrails than any other place I remember. It's obviously mind-control at an epic scale over the entire Federal workforce.
Then I grew up next to Carswell AFB where the Roswell remains were first sent.
The thing about the kook conspiracies is that you usually don't need the conspiracy for something to be bad, and then people forget about *actual* bona fide conspiracies. You don't really need a conspiracy to explain why Oswald shot JFK or Ruby shot Oswald. And then we have the actual big conspiracy that led to Booth shooting Lincoln, and everybody now seems to think about it like a straightforward assassination.
But speaking of actual smoke-filled rooms, my college internship was with my congressman Dick Armey. And I remember one day in 1997 when he walked in and announced "We've picked W. Bush to be the next President", and that kind of moment impressed me at the time, that a few guys actually met in a room and came to that decision, and that was *the* decision. And at that time, these really were the guys (the "Contract w/America" Leadership) that could hand-pick the next Presidential nominee. Just now with the Tea Party thing the Republicans aren't as top-down driven as they used to be (Armey did write a book called "Tea Party Manifesto", which I found funny, considering the TPs are supposed to be anti-establishment and you couldn't be more establishment than him); so it's not clear who the next Republican nominee will be. But in the case of W, that was a definite establishment move, as most Rep Nominees were pretty much from Einsenhower to W, to be fair.
CCCToad on 10/5/2011 at 21:50
Its a bit hard to tell with the Tea Party. Some of them are driven independently, but one of the tactics that the leadership uses in their bid to maintain control of the Tea Party is to brand themselves as Tea Parties and attempt to assume de-facto control of the Tea Part. Hannity is probably the best example. He sells himself as a Tea Party leader, then consistently backs the GOP establishment even doing so involves sticking up for figures that have trashed the grassroots Tea Party (ie, Rove).
And, agreed about their nominees. The only one who is a possible exception is Reagan. He lost to the establishment's favorite candidate on his first attempt and even when he won he was still pretty unpopular among the "country club" Republicans. What I have no idea on (if thats true) is how he managed to get around the massive vote fraud that characterizes GOP primaries.
CCCToad on 10/5/2011 at 22:05
Quote Posted by gunsmoke
I used to live in Dayton, OH. Maybe you've heard of our famous Air Force Base? Wright-Patt? There are an awful lot of people that work there that say those damn Chemtrails are real. I dunno. I haven't made up my mind yet.
Familiar with it. We have a lot of Air Force facilities around here too, and the activity I saw (about five or six cargo jets spraying in a circular pattern) had always been near their facilities.
What I don't get is the secrecy. Whereas America instinctively drifts in the direction of denying everything and branding any discussion of it ccrazy talk, other countries (
http://www.usatoday.com/weather/research/2008-02-29-china-weather_N.htm) brag openly about doing the same thing
DDL on 10/5/2011 at 23:07
Pretty sure the chinese cloud seeding didn't really work, anyway. In fact the evidence for cloud seeding in general is pretty shaky. Sure, you can form clouds by and large on demand, especially if the conditions are good (like the contrails in that video, which are just condensing water vapour out, which that acts to nucleate larger more diffuse clouds), but after that..they're fucking clouds. You don't get to say what they do or how they behave. They might drift away, rain on the thirsty fields of your hated liberal enemies, or just vanish again.
And fuck me, if you're citing cloud seeding as "shifty conspiracy theory" then you are YEARS behind the curve.
Tocky on 11/5/2011 at 04:44
Look, I don't know about this chemtrail stuff (except that DDL is right) but Al Quaeda was going to hijack those trains and drive them into the pentagon so quit making fun. I don't want to have to lay awake in bed at night worrying about getting run over by a train.
Yes, I do sleep at the pentagon. It's quiet there.
CCCToad on 12/5/2011 at 22:38
Quote Posted by Queue
Okay, I'm going to bite. So, CCCToad, when did these "chemtrails" that you're speaking of start, and why?
I honestly have no idea as to when, and can only speculate as to why. Only thing that I know for certain is that I never saw them prior to moving to Colorado, but on several instances saw what looked like large cargo planes spraying "contrails" that did not dissipate like normal contrails but quickly (over about 30-60 seconds) billowed out clouds with a density and color similar to cirrus clouds. When I've seen them all operating in the same place, they typically fly in a zig zag pattern. Combined with the wind, this causes a large overcast area.
DDL on 12/5/2011 at 23:38
Ok, so: where did you live before?
Humidity makes a huge difference: ideal conditions would be high humidity (so you get a lot of nucleated condensation) and clear skies (so you actually see it). Where I am, you see massive amounts of cirrus-like clouds streaked across the skies in summer, when it's humid but relatively clear, but very few the rest of the year, because it's fucking manchester and is generally massively overcast and raining. Colorado airport is in a fairly humid area, according to google.
Also, when you say "zig zag" do you mean an actual plane is jinking back and forth in a zigzag pattern, or that multiple planes are travelling in straight lines, but leaving overlapping trails? If the latter: this is how planes fly near airports. Your average airport has maybe one or two runways, and uses them for both takeoffs and landings, thus all planes landing and taking off end up heading in one of four directions. If the runways are parallel, one of two directions. The consequence of this is lots of wide angle, overlapping, approaches/departures.
Also, can you honestly say you can accurately gauge the difference between a commercial airliner and a cargo plane? Actually, a little research (google again...or are they a conspiracy-fuel source too?) shows a few military airports in the same sort of area as the commercial airport, so I'm not sure it makes a difference.
TL: DR version: planes just make fucking clouds in humid areas, k?
