Scott Weiland on 30/4/2011 at 19:52
I know what game design means, but one of you started talking about barrels like a blim blam, also I'm pretty sure Goldmoon Down didn't mean just gameplay when saying 'design', don't you think he woulda said 'gameplay' instead if he meant only gameplay? Such airheads, I don't even.
Goldmoon Dawn on 30/4/2011 at 20:03
I am surprised you havent just left this thread yet, but go ahead. Keep talking. :)
ZylonBane on 30/4/2011 at 20:05
He has to be trolling. Anyone this genuinely dumb would have forgotten to breath by now.
voodoo47 on 30/4/2011 at 21:40
shouldn't that be "breathe"?
ZylonBane on 30/4/2011 at 22:12
Nuts, I forgot to type "regularly take a" in front of that.
demagogue on 1/5/2011 at 00:32
Anyway, all this talk about "complexity" and "minimalism" is beside the point that Achievements are a major part of mainstream gaming culture that developed in the last decade and are linked with a definite kind of game design philosophy we're all familiar with, that started in console gaming and is now everywhere and a lot of gamers take it for granted and expect it.
We didn't see it 10-15 years ago simply because it wasn't part of gaming culture back then like it is now.
jtr7 on 1/5/2011 at 01:33
Anyhoo... Thanks, Digi!
nicked on 1/5/2011 at 08:46
While the chances of getting a good, immersive, non-linear Thief 4 that doesn't diarrhoea all over it's legacy are about as likely as the second coming of Christ, I am kinda curious as to how achievements might work in a Thief game. I'm talking proper achievements, not "Finish the level" ones. I guess you'd have "Find all the loot", probably some detrimentally inane ones like "Get 100 knockouts" or "Fire 500 arrows" but there could be an opportunity for some interesting ones like "Finish the game without anyone knowing you were there." But as the Randy Smith interview points out, it is kinda sad that gamers need that kind of recognition. Plenty of people round here play Thief as a "ghost" or other playing styles, just for their own enjoyment. Would it detract from that enjoyment if you got a little pop-up message telling you how good you are? I'd say at the least it would be immersion-breaking in a game like Thief.
Koki on 1/5/2011 at 09:24
Quote Posted by nicked
But as the Randy Smith interview points out, it is kinda sad that gamers need that kind of recognition. Plenty of people round here play Thief as a "ghost" or other playing styles, just for their own enjoyment. Would it detract from that enjoyment if you got a little pop-up message telling you how good you are? I'd say at the least it would be immersion-breaking in a game like Thief.
GOD THOSE FUCKING POPUPS! IF ONLY THERE WAS A WAY TO TURN THEM OFF! :mad:
nbohr1more on 1/5/2011 at 15:52
I agree that achievement as we've seen in contemporary console culture are not a good fit for Thief but I think Randy's line of thought is to ponder further movement towards the addition of RPG story tree elements in this type of game. He's just illuminating the razor's edge of where what we consider the "Immersive Sim" moves into RPG territory.
If the consequences of meta-gameplay manifest in some kind of internal stat that magically and subtly changes guard behavior (etc) then I would say that this is a natural evolution of the Immersive Sim genre. If that stat is something that is visible and manageable by players and/or bluntly makes a huge story tree change, then we have entered into RPG territory.
I think I prefer the former to the latter :sweat:
