CCCToad on 2/10/2011 at 17:25
Then leave it to Tocky to take issue if he so chooses.
Quote:
This is getting pretty epic tbh
I'm surprised as well. I was expecting this to quietly go away after the media ignored it for a week or two. Its worth wondering whether that happened was planned though. If a protest organizer is following Alinksy's playbook, he knows that the easiest way to make a movement successful is to goad the opposition into over-reacting and victimizing somebody on your side. Since most police these days tend to react to being filmed as if somebody just drew a gun on them this isn't a particularly difficult situation to cause. All you need to do is make sure that you have a secondary camera-man(preferably using a hidden camera) in position to film the filmer when the inevitable beat down occurs.
Rug Burn Junky on 2/10/2011 at 17:37
If he's smart, he'll politely ignore your gibberish. I'm just doing you the favor of pointing out that you're an ass.
"Oh no, the Democrats are almost just as bad." Errr, no. Truly no. You even recognize this, which is why you push out there, and back-peddle every single time. So just stop being a douche and saying it in the first place. Even lesser-of-two evils is a qualitative difference, so getting all masturbatorily gleeful every time you can point it out does no one any good. We get it. You're jaded and cynical about politics. Nobody gives a shit. Shut the fuck up.
"Oh the Tea Party was originally anti cronyism." No, actually, the Tea party genesis was in outrage about a potential HOMEOWNER bailout. Watch the Rick Santelli clip, look back at the coverage of the original Tea Party rallies. It was about no taxes, no bailouts for homeowners. Pretty much exactly the opposite of the genesis for OWS. Fuck, it was anti-stimulus right from the outset. The anti-cronyism may have crept in there, because it was useful to try to paint any government spending in anti-obama attacks, but it wasn't co-opted away from that, that simply wasn't how it started.
Fuck, this should be simple, if you had any capacity to pay attention.
So again, you're starting from base misconceptions, and the rest of what you say is accordingly meaningless.
So I repeat, shut the fuck up.
Rug Burn Junky on 2/10/2011 at 18:34
Quote Posted by demagogue
There's a Tea Party chapter in practically every other town in the whole country, well the chapters don't matter compared to the sheer number of people that self identify with it, and I remember the big rallies they had in DC that just kept going and going with floods of people... All of them thinking politics.
That came later though. Originally, the Tea Party was a one-day thing that was supposed to flame out, but it was kept alive and grew over time - mostly by moneyed interests and Fox cheerleading, but kept alive nonetheless.
And it's not just 30 seconds on the news. It's growing to different cities as of this week, and internationally soon as well. And when you see the scope of it developing in NYC, it's impressive, but more than the number of bodies, is the downright sincerity - something the Tea Party never really had. The tea party grew out of amorphous fear of gubmint - "Don't tax me, bro" - but most of those were unfounded, drummed up fears. Sure, the participants really believed them, but they hadn't experienced them because they simply didn't exist.
Look through the 99% tumblr. Those are real consequences of the recession. There's an underclass of recent graduates who are being shut out of participating in society. (and if you are familiar with economics papers on the subject, they will suffer for the rest of their careers, losing out on salary over and above the gap in initial employment, graduates during a recession have decreased earnings through-out their working life as compared to their cohorts who graduated in better times.) Sure, they get the big picture stuff incorrect in exactly the same way as the tea party, but that's fixable, since as the movement matures they will need to confront these policy realities (in a way that repetitive internet trolls never seem to). The difference is that unlike the tea party, they get the real-world consequences correct because they're living them, not imagining them in their paranoid fever dreams
That's why I finally have some hope that there is a possibility of a grass roots progressive movement finally being viable. The desperation and sincerity to drive it are finally there, and the people who are doing so are acting out of necessity, not ideology or ginned up fears. I share Tocky's concern that " not enough have lost their jobs and health insurance ... yet"* but I don't think that's necessary for people to grasp the stakes. They surely know enough people who have struggled with it, and continue to do so. And in spite of the coverage as ineffectual ninnies - plenty of whom exist - there is some real thought going in to the movement as a whole, and it just takes time for it to coalesce into something deeper. The two of my friends who are most involved (both of whom were (
http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/10/01/police-arresting-protesters-on-brooklyn-bridge/) arrested on the Brooklyn Bridge yesterday), are two of the smartest fuckers I've ever met. Both Ivy league grad students who truly give a shit about the cause. That matters.
*If Tocky were Paul Krugman, cue the right-wing blogs and Fox Newsiots claiming that Tocky just wants people to get laid off and lose their health insurance.
Tocky on 3/10/2011 at 02:32
My giving in to despair is more understandable when you take into account I'm from the state that elected Haley Barbour. If 1984 were around the corner 90% of the states salt of the earth god and guns crowd would skip merrily around it cursing liberals and lazy young folks all the while collecting SSI checks because they are too fat to work. I swear I listen to religious radio promote letting those without insurance die and die a little myself inside. It wears me down.
But I still hope. Though republicans make it obvious they have the rich mans bit in thier mouths at every gee and haw, and yes some democrats have given in to the dark side in the past, this 99% thing gives me the sort of slim hope I had for the Giants before they won the superbowl.
Rug Burn Junky on 3/10/2011 at 04:00
You were only rooting for them because of Eli, right?
june gloom on 3/10/2011 at 05:58
Looks like they may be sending in the Marines... to protect the protestors.
I can't find any real confirmation, though, just rumors going around lefty blogs and Ron Paul's website.
Forever420 on 3/10/2011 at 13:51
LOL fool, the man will send in troops but to beat on the truth warriors not protect them.
Tocky on 4/10/2011 at 02:13
Heh. Ron Paul being in on any of this shocks hell out of me.
Quote Posted by Rug Burn Junky
You were only rooting for them because of Eli, right?
Yep. My dad took me to Ole Miss games when Archie was proving everyone wrong. A lot of cherished memories were made. Eli chose the rebs like his dad and gave us winning seasons. Shit, I even named my cat Eli the year he chose us. When he proved the commentators wrong in the superbowl it was the sort of come from behind pull it out his ass thing his dad used to do. It was a fist pumping dance around vindication of heart over reason. I can't wait till his son comes to Ole Miss, we might just have a winning season again.
