Azaran on 15/9/2011 at 01:44
Quote Posted by Ghostly Apparition
The major corporations are sitting on trillions of dollars of wealth.. many corporations are not just paying low taxes..they are paying no taxes..GE, Bank of America and many others paid 0 taxes last year.
Thank you
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http://i.somethingawful.com/forumsystem/emoticons/emot-colbert.gifscarykitties on 15/9/2011 at 01:47
It's kind of a circle. There aren't jobs because there is low demand. There is low demand because the market is poor. The market is poor because people aren't buying. People aren't buying because they don't have jobs. Certainly some other factors got us into this loop, but that's where we are right now.
Pyrian on 15/9/2011 at 01:50
Quote Posted by heywood
For example, if you try to fuck the rich today you'll just drive entrepreneurs and top talent out of the US, which didn't happen in the 1950s. There is some room today to increase individual taxes on the wealthy. For example, bring the top marginal rate back to where it was in the 1990s and treat capital gains like income. But forget about imposing confiscatory (e.g. 90%) rates again. People will just say fuck off and earn their income elsewhere and/or get their compensation in other ways.
While I agree that mid 90's would be a better model than 50's (but BTW the nominal rate may have been 90 but nobody actually paid that, IIRC the effective rate was like 50, kind of like how now the nominal rate is like 35 and effective is like 21) I'm really kind of dubious about this whole "entrepreneurs and top talent" notion. IMO important top talents are almost entirely upper middle class professionals, and very rare among the ultra-rich magnates themselves. (In fact, they'd be wasted in such positions, and vice-versa.) If we want talent, we'd better get back to funding education.
Quote Posted by scarykitties
So, which political candidates, if any, understand the system to this degree?
My suspicion is virtually all of them. :joke: ...Maybe not Bachmann or Paul... But for a politician, that doesn't matter so much; what they say is designed to be heard, what they do is designed to get money - campaign contributions or a job in a think tank.
Quote Posted by scarykitties
Isn't the Obama jobs plan supposed to do something similar to this?
Yes and no. Both the stimulus and the new plan both contained more money on stuff we know won't help much, or just offsets of the downward spiral States are in, than the sort of stimulus spending that would really help. But there is some good stuff in there.
Quote Posted by scarykitties
Why, then, do so many say that it won't work?
Like the stimulus before it, it's substantially too small to actually fix the problem. Kind of like getting your car 1/5th of the way out of a ditch. It'd help - but it won't get you back on the road.
scarykitties on 15/9/2011 at 02:02
Quote Posted by Pyrian
Yes and no. Both the stimulus and the new plan both contained more money on stuff we know won't help much, or just offsets of the downward spiral States are in, than the sort of stimulus spending that would really help. But there is some good stuff in there.
Yeah. Supposedly, some red tape that slows business start-ups is supposed to be cut to make it easier for entrepreneurs to begin new companies. Also, patents will be filed based on who does the paperwork first, rather than on who actually built the thing first. This means that patent claims can be filed much faster, but it also gives large corporations the opportunity to monopolize patents since it doesn't matter who actually made the thing first and instead is all about who gets their paperwork to the desk first. And corporations are much faster at filing patents than the average Joe.
Still, it could mean a sudden influx of new inventions that had been sitting, waiting to be filed, which could mean a technology boom that creates new opportunities, investments, and growth.
As for the job stimulus thing, there is a concern that companies will cheat the system to get the tax reductions on technicalities. For instance, hiring a worker back to get the tax reduction benefits, then laying them off again soon afterward.
june gloom on 15/9/2011 at 03:07
Unlike CCCToad this one's capable of learning and admitting he's wrong. We got lucky this time.
Forever420 on 15/9/2011 at 03:47
Quote:
The idea that "Job creators need more money" is patently incorrect, and easily falsifiable. How come? Well, they HAVE plenty of money. Not just in the "oh, rich people are rich sense," but in a more real, tangible sense. Read the financial statements of any major corporation... profits are up, and they are sitting on piles of cash.
Ruggums my brother, corporations do not create jobs and work for the downtrodden masses but live to stash the cash for the fat hogs, lavishing in luxury and wine and women and song whilst those of us who work for our food suffer under the boot of their oppression. Is it not people who make the jobs my brother, and not the machine of corporatism?
june gloom on 15/9/2011 at 05:00
GOD JUST SHUT UP.
Boxsmith on 15/9/2011 at 05:09
please don't
never, ever shut up
Tocky on 15/9/2011 at 05:10
Uh... yeah, fight the power my brother. That WAS beautiful RBJ. I tend to just say money doesn't trickle down, it gushes up, and leave the dots to be connected. And the goldbuggers thing was so succinct it tickled my prostate. You know of course nothing drives up the price of gold like a good depression so that may be some of the reason but I figure the depressed wages would make us competative with China and since they can't buy into a communist system like they want and good luck burrowing up in Europe the ultrarich figure after the food riots and just before Mad Max land kicks in they can reinvest in the US. I don't know that they don't figure Brazile looks good this time of decade though.
You KNOW the ultarich know this stuff and yet hire radio and TV to do a "these aren't the droids you are looking for" on the masses ala Limbaugh-Hannity-Beck fuck em all (the poor) and let God sort em so they have something they are working toward surely. Wave that flag and hate that fag while they screw the country and everyone in it bless us every one.
The bad part is I no longer know how hyperbolic I'm being. What the fuck IS the ultrarich agenda? It can't be just money as the be all of existence I'm not happy till I have every dollar can it? There has to be SOME plan though maybe not collective right? It often seems like a concerted effort what with the streamlining of politician buying ala Citizens United and Fox. ARE they lizzard men? I mean christ they bought a whole political party fucksakes.
Forever420 on 15/9/2011 at 08:30
Lizzard men would be a betterment, my comrade. For the lizard men, or those they call the "grays" seem as saintly beings when stood in lineup against the serpent which lies within a rich man's heart.
