fortuni on 14/7/2022 at 16:37
This thread is very old, if I was you I wouldn't rely on it any more. To see which missions have dml's check the Brief Summaries thread, I've place a note at the bottom of every mission description for those missions with dml's.
As for Horns of Canzo: A Long Way Up I replayed it a couple of years ago with Newmantle turned on and finished it no problem.
I think I know which water tunnel your talking about, if so, no your not meant to be able to mantle up into that cave (I remember checking with Unna at the time and she confirmed that the author had set it up that way) but there is something at the edge of the hole of the cave that your meant to grab and then go back.
baeuchlein on 14/7/2022 at 19:57
fortuni, I think you are referring to one of the partially flooded tunnels which leads to a cave mouth near which there is a nugget or some other little valuable thing, sitting on a ledge, which the player can grab. The player can do this without leaving the water, and AFAIK, there's nothing else there that would be of interest to the player. This cave mouth or exit has open skies above, I think.
However, there is another part of the water tunnel system which also has a problem with NewMantle. There is nothing there near the water which can be taken, but the player indeed could mantle or jump out of the water, and continue into the cave system, reaching a "water lock" (I think) and some other places of interest, e.g., the one with the "sea chest" for which there exists a key somewhere else. In this case there are no open skies above the player when leaving the water, but instead one is still in a cave system. I also noticed that one could not exit the water anymore in NewDark with Newmantle on and without any means of help.
In OldDark, the player could just climb or jump out of the water. With NewDark, the player either has to switch off Newmantle, or has to carry a crate along, release it in the water so that it floats up, and then has to use the surfaced crate to somehow climb or jump out of the water. I also think that the problem there does at least make it very difficult to finish the mission, and possibly make it impossible to accomplish on higher difficulty levels, unless you master that floating crate stunt.
I remember switching off Newmantle by placing an appropriate command in a FM.CFG file in the FM archive for testing purposes, and I think I completed the mission then. But so far I have not been able to find that FM archive again in the pigsty I call my backup hard disks:cheeky:... so I can't swear I really did it.:p
fortuni on 15/7/2022 at 04:48
I think I have found the hole your talking about (look for Obj 2174 in Dromed) and yes can mantle out of hole in Olddark but not with Newdark, can you confirm this is the right place please and 'll ask Glypher/Jax to add a line to the dml to fix this issue.
fortuni on 15/7/2022 at 14:36
Quote Posted by LaughingMan008
Its actually in the walkthrough that you're supposed to go that way.
That's the spot.
Just because Ricebug, Nightwalker or myself say in a walkthrough that your supposed to go one way does not mean that is the only way you can get to where you want to go, this is Thief after all. :D
PS. Have posted a request on Shadowbox to get dml amended.
baeuchlein on 15/7/2022 at 16:17
This is also the spot I was referring to. (And I have finally rediscovered my own version of HoC1 with that Newmantle disable command in it.:cheeky:)
I have now verified that you can indeed come from the other side to the same location (and, most important, the Water lock), at least on easiest and hardest difficulty. Didn't check the "Snake" difficulty, though.
This stunt goes as follows: Go into the cave at the one end of the river where the wooden bridge and a crate are present, then hack away the stalagmites/stalagites there with the sword (buy it at the shop), or with the Blackjack, if you're masochistic or just desperate. The idea is to clear a passage for you, so you have to destroy about half of the obstacles there.
You arrive in a location with a deep water pool around which a walkway with battlements is leading into caves with plants and nasty burricks. Don't go there, though, but dive into the deep pool and get the invisibility potion (and a key as well) from down there. Be careful, as there are one or two large flying insects there wishing to show you what their sting is for. Then, go to a metal door near one end of the walkway, position yourself so that you're not seen from the inside once the door opens, and then pick the lock.
Drink the potion so that the Water element in there does not see you, grab a key from a wall box there, and use it to unlock the other door in the small room. Get through, close the door before the potion's effect wears off, and then walk along the passage. You will eventually get to the spot where you could not get out of the water with Newmantle, and you will also pass by the Water lock.
So, while it is possible to get there even without being able to leave the water in the cave, it is really very tedious, so I'll not complain if there's an addition to the DML.:)
LaughingMan008 on 15/7/2022 at 21:25
Quote Posted by fortuni
Just because Ricebug, Nightwalker or myself say in a walkthrough that your supposed to go one way does not mean that is the only way you can get to where you want to go, this is Thief after all. :D
Oh, I know. And I only resort to walkthroughs when I'm hopelessly stuck. XD
Which I was. For whatever reason I just could not figure out that other way forward, even after looking at the walkthrough. It was that cave or nothing for me at the time. I have since figured out the other way forward that I missed. Thanks for your help as always.
