TDS mini-campaign "THE CABAL": part 2 "Night of the Long Knives" by Ziemanskye

Acolyte6 on 10/11/2010 at 01:54

Part 1 was awesome. My hardware had no problem at all with it, even the quick reload button was not a problem. Just started Part 2, but I need to ask. Can't you turn the light gem down so that Garrett can hide? I just ran through the cemetery and into a building with a book and candle on a long desk to hide from a hammer that was chasing me, but I can't find any darkness anywhere. Even outside in a corner of 2 buildings with no windows facing me the gem light is way too bright :(

Acolyte6 on 10/11/2010 at 02:01

Quote Posted by nightchild

Thank you Ziemanskye for the explanations.Vista is realy bad for the health.
Any way just for the record, I am pretty sure that most of the players where going close to most of the doors/windows to see if they highlight any way, so you probably were "overprotective" about our playing convenience!
I have never used this editor so I don't now its limitations and as for the design I can only say WOOW!
you have made an amazing job.
I 'm sorry Vista broke down your hard work.
Some areas were so sureal and so out of a dream/nightmare that I would like to see them again if you manage to overcome the pc problems :)

This is really weird, I have no problems running the editor in Vista :confused:

nightchild on 10/11/2010 at 09:53

Quote Posted by pwyll

I haven't finished this mission yet but I have an opinion.

This mission reminds me about Thief 2. Vast areas with large buildings. The buildings are very cool when looked from the outside. Nice new objects. It is good to practice freerun on the roofs.

There is nothing much to do. Too little light sources, no loot, too bright ambient light, cannot hide in a dark corners, guards are always alerted (although you can perform sneak attacks), doors cannot be opened, some places with low resolution textures, cannot break into most of the buildings, the buildings where Garrett can enter are almost empty. I'm just running and running and running. And I cannot find where I'm supposed to go. The map is OK but there are no labels on the buildings, no obvious landmarks and I'm completely lost. Not enjoyable. I expected more from you, Ziemanskye. I liked your previous missions but this is so unfinished.

Ziemanskye explained he had some problems, but anyway from what I remember, for the first objective have you seen a place like a tavern, you can't go in, but it has a small yard with tables, bright light everywere and I think a small fountain/ tap?You can go there also from around a square(?) with some wooden stractures like huts/market benches?At that yard anyway, you have to look around to find something small I hope I made some sense!

Tiens on 11/11/2010 at 05:00

Quote Posted by Acolyte6

Can't you turn the light gem down so that Garrett can hide? ...I can't find any darkness anywhere...

It's simply impossible for now. The light gem brightness depends on the total level's brightness. There's no lights in the streets, so I simply can't decrease the brightness - in this case you will not see your own nose.

New Horizon on 11/11/2010 at 05:09

Quote Posted by Tiens

There's a setting for lights to give them a lightgem 'weight'. The TDS designers used this setting on the moonbeam shafts so that they wouldn't increase the lightgem level to insane levels when mixed with the ambient level light.

I think it was just something called 'lightweight'. I can't see why it wouldn't work on the ambient level lighting.

Tiens on 11/11/2010 at 06:29

New Horizon, there is NO LIGHTS in the streets at all. And level's properties simply doesn't have such kind of property.

pwyll on 11/11/2010 at 08:39

@nightchild

I had already completed the first objective when I wrote my comment. But thanks anyway. Now I cannot finish the second objective and I'm tired of running around like a headless fly.

I'm currently enjoying another TDS FM. Maybe, MAYBE later I will install Night of the Long Knives again and try to finish it.

nightchild on 11/11/2010 at 12:36

Quote Posted by pwyll

I am sure you have been at the place that fulfills your second obj. previously. The same happened
to me.Any way, If you wish to go there again:
it's inside an open building that looks like a townhall(?) you go up some sets of stairs and you find an office with an open safe and looks like items in there are thrown all over the place.
And for the third one, you have to find the way to go up at the cathedral's terrace

Judith on 12/11/2010 at 12:27

Quote Posted by Tiens

New Horizon, there is NO LIGHTS in the streets at all. And level's properties simply doesn't have such kind of property.

You can influence the lightgem behavior even without any lights in the level, using a pair of scripts and volumes. While I was experimenting on my daylight snowy mission, I created a simple system allowing Garrett to hide in the bushes, holes in the ground and such.

Ziemanskye on 13/11/2010 at 15:15

Assuming you still have the capability of editing scripts...

Yes, it really did get that bad, in the end.

Also, there is a light on the streets, unless Tiens took it out on the version she released, since I used a massive directional light so that one side of the buildngs and the rooftops are slightly brighter: I had an idea on a better way to do that, but the editor gave up totally on me before I could give it a shot.

So, frankly it's not a criticism to say the level is unfinished. It's the inconvenient truth of it: I expected more for this level as well, but have now been forced into finding something else to edit for.

And as for the lack of loot - there is one other "argument" for not having any, and it's a bad one because it's meta-game knowledge. As there's no shop between levels, and because I knew all along Garrett was going in the river at the end - I should've just found some way to put loot in when I still had more ability to edit the level, meta-game be damned, but I was still thinking visual art rather than gameplay.

(also, to those who haven't had so much trouble with Vista, I'm also on a laptop, which may be part of the problem: if /windows/ updates, but toshiba don't offer new drivers to account for whatever's changed, I get screwed. As an example there's never been an updated graphics driver for this machine: the general ones you can download off of the internet just say "you're on a laptop, get the update from the manufacturer" if I try to use them, so the problems may not just be entirely Vistas fault. I just gets all the blame.)