Thank You, America. - by Nicker
Phatose on 11/11/2012 at 00:02
I'm pretty sure in terms of actual efficiency, world average for a coal burning plants is actually 31%. Not exactly breathtaking.
jay pettitt on 11/11/2012 at 00:27
Quote Posted by Peanuckle
Stuff
I'm sorry peanuckle, but you don't know the first thing of which you speak.
Firstly I didn't ignore additional costs. I specifically said that you want to look at those.
Quote Posted by jay pettitt
What you want to look at is net production, energy return on investment and additional costs. In short, how much for how much and when.
See.
Secondly you massively overestimate (it's not really an estimate is it, you just don't know) the efficiency of fossil fuel plant. Most big coal plant has a thermal efficiency of around 30%. The very best shiny combined cycle gas plant gets to around 55% peak (typically its less, but the gas guys are excited by the shiny, so what the hell). But none of that includes sourcing your fuel - let alone construction and maintenance. We have good metrics for comparing different technologies. Thermal efficiency of the turbines is not one of them. It's useful for comparing similar technologies, but not different ones.
Your Land efficiency argument is also entirely misleading. Not only are you ignoring the land used to source fuel (surface mining), crucially you also ignore whether the land has value. Typically you site solar arrays where land is cheap - roof space, deserts and the like.
What you're doing is called cherry picking (or at least what the person who told you a crock to tosh did). You're picking and choosing the one or two things that allow you to make a predetermined argument - that solar is somehow unsuitable for energy production (despite the inconvenient fact that it is used increasingly for energy production) - and ignoring the sum of the data that points to something else entirely. Yes solar is new and strange. Yes it's a relatively small player in the mix right now - but that will change. Solar is actually a very good technology that can and will grow fast in the US.
I don't have a dog in the nuclear fight. Broadly I'm in favour, but it's not a tech you can easily balance in a grid with varying demand, unlike wind which is very good for balancing production and demand. That's not a reason not to do it, but you have to understand that different technologies have different quirks and fitting them together isn't straightforward.
Azaran on 12/11/2012 at 02:29
And now 15 conservative states have asked to (
http://www.examiner.com/article/15-states-including-texas-have-filed-a-petition-to-secede-from-the-united-states-1) secede from the US
As of Saturday November 10, 2012, 15 States have petitioned the Obama Administration for withdrawal from the United States of America in order to create its own government.
States following this action include: Louisiana, Texas, Montana, North Dakota, Indiana, Mississippi, Kentucky, North Carolina, Alabama, Florida, Georgia, New Jersey, Colorado, Oregon and New York. These States have requested that the Obama Administration grant a peaceful withdrawal from the United States.
These citizen generated petitions were filed just days after the 2012 Presidential election.
Louisiana was the first State to file a petition a day after the election by a Michael E. from Slidell, Louisiana. Texas was the next State to follow by a Micah H. from Arlington, Texas.
The government allows one month from the day the petition is submitted to obtain 25,000 signatures in order for the Obama administration to consider the request.
The Texas petition reads as follows:
The US continues to suffer economic difficulties stemming from the federal government’s neglect to reform domestic and foreign spending. The citizens of the US suffer from blatant abuses of their rights such as the NDAA, the TSA, etc. Given that the state of Texas maintains a balanced budget and is the 15th largest economy in the world, it is practically feasible for Texas to withdraw from the union, and to do so would protect it’s citizens’ standard of living and re-secure their rights and liberties in accordance with the original ideas and beliefs of our founding fathers which are no longer being reflected by the federal government.
As of 12:46 am, Sunday, signatures obtained by Louisiana, 7,358; Texas, 3,771; Florida, 636; Georgia, 475; Alabama, 834; North Carolina, 792; Kentucky, 467; Mississippi, 475; Indiana, 449; North Dakota, 162; Montana, 440; Colorado, 324; Oregon, 328; New Jersey, 301 and New York, 169. Many more States are expected to follow.
A petition is not searchable at WhiteHouse.gov until 150 signatures have been obtained. It is the originator's responsibility to obtain these signatures.
The Texas petition can be reviewed and/or signed by clicking here.Fafhrd on 12/11/2012 at 02:46
More like 'a handful of people from conservative states have filed to secede.' These aren't formal petitions from Governors or state legislatures, they're petitions from butthurt rednecks with very little understanding of how the government works.
Angel Dust on 12/11/2012 at 02:51
New York? Wasn't that a comfortable victory for Obama there?
Azaran on 12/11/2012 at 02:55
Yeah, a few of them are unexpected. What's funny is they complain about supposed 'abuses', but they only have a problem with them if it's a democrat who's in power. When Bush was passing tons of security laws, you didn't hear any of them complaining.
demagogue on 12/11/2012 at 05:40
New York state ("upstate") != New York City. Two very different cultures.
None of them are too surprising, especially when you're only talking about a few hundred people. Anytime you have any backwoods region, you'll have these kinds of people in the woodwork.
The whole thing is laughable political farce though, except it's not funny. Just sad. Not sure I could roll my eyes any harder.
Vasquez on 12/11/2012 at 06:01
I thought it was at least giggle-worthy funny :joke:
demagogue on 12/11/2012 at 06:33
It's absurd theatre, definitely worth laughing at.
What isn't so funny is that the people doing it aren't laughing themselves but seem half-serious. (A few of my old friends are talking about it without any irony).
Course you could just go this angle with it too:
Inline Image:
http://i47.tinypic.com/2uzs1mv.jpgCCCToad on 12/11/2012 at 08:23
Quote Posted by Azaran
Yeah, a few of them are unexpected. What's funny is they complain about supposed 'abuses', but they only have a problem with them if it's a democrat who's in power. When Bush was passing tons of security laws, you didn't hear any of them complaining.
And Vice Versa. What happened to the hordes of Democrats protesting that the president went to war without congress's approval? oh wait.....
This binary thinking is a pity, because it turns otherwise rational people into blithering idiots.
