nbohr1more on 30/3/2015 at 14:17
Hello TTLG!
This is probably much ado about nothing but I thought I would start a little discussion to gauge the disposition of the TTLG FM community with regards to The Dark Mod.
It seems that someone (possibly a troll) recently commented on our Moddb page indicating that TDM has been discouraging T1\T2 FM authors from joining TDM by our "behavior".
So I ask you:
"If you had ever considered making a TDM mission, was there something or did someone say or do anything to sour you on the idea?"
"Is there something that TDM as a platform lacks which is a show-stopper for you to delve into it?"
"If you were on the fence about making a TDM mission, is there a feature that would make you jump in and try?"
"Should TDM bother courting FM authors directly rather than targeting players, coders, and asset creators as we've traditionally done (with the expectation that FM authors will follow the former)?"
Cardia on 30/3/2015 at 14:52
As far as i´m concerned i prefer t2 and t1 gameplay and maps size capacity , i wish that TDM authors would move to Dromed . But hey i still like to play TDM missions and i thank the authors for creating them, but its hard to find variable type of missions though, most TDM authors are very similar to each other, they get to choose to create the same kind of maps, atmospheres and gameplay. Komag did however something original for TDM, a daylight mission with a huge moving metal structure to climb, that was refreshing ;)
Springheel on 30/3/2015 at 20:01
Quote:
its hard to find variable type of missions though, most TDM authors are very similar to each other, they get to choose to create the same kind of maps, atmospheres and gameplay.
How different from each other do they have to be? In addition to the one you mention, there's a daylight detective mission; a sprawling underground lost city mission; a murder mystery mission in an empty mansion; a mission on a flying ship, a mission in a bizarre alternate reality, and a haunted mission with no AI whatosever. Is the percentage of "non-standard" missions really that different from T2 FMs? (granted we don't have anything on a spaceship yet) ;)
Jaime Lannister on 31/3/2015 at 00:28
Someone who feels differently can correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that the lack of Dromed mappers working on the Dark Mod has much to do with "relations" but simply more with practicality. Most people who have spent years learning and mastering the finicky beast that is Dromed probably will not want to switch to Dark Radiant and spend all that time unlearning Dromed's quirks to learn Dark Radiant's (Melan is the obvious exception). Either that or they just prefer the original games' gameplay and map sizes, as Cardia said. The flying ship mission that Springheel mentioned is good but it's also extremely short, for instance.
I think you guys are going to have a hard time in general trying to recruit veteran T1/T2 FM authors, despite the considerable effort you put in. You'd be better off looking for more guys like Sotha, Moonbo, and Kvorning - guys that have phenomenal talent but have never touched Dromed. Guys like that can start fresh mapping for TDM and have less to no emotional attachment to Dromed.
Quote Posted by Springheel
a mission in a bizarre alternate reality
Which one is this? "Illusionist's Tower"? I really liked that one.
Quote Posted by Springheel
a murder mystery mission in an empty mansion
I hope you're not talking about "A Night to Remember". That mission has been broken since before 2.03 and you know this. Are you talking about a different one?
OldMeat on 31/3/2015 at 01:19
I agree with the last post about more people having spent time with the difficulties of the dromed editor.
I have only recently been using the TDM for not quite half a year now, but even before I downloaded it to try it for myself I would watch videos of gameplay and appreciated it. :cool: :thumb::thumb::thumb:
I myself do prefer the size of many of the dromed maps, but lately I think that many authors for T1/TG/T2 spend too much time making efforts to have their missions play with higher graphic capabilities and this had made alot of problems for some of us players with slower machines, with mine being about 1.75ghz in processing speed.
It seems like they are trying to have their missions look like those with higher level graphic processing ability much like the TDM or TDS missions and it slows down my machine so much that I can sometimes barely move without looking down to keep from over taxing my CPU.
The appeal of the Dromed engine to me is and in most cases was the gameplay itself.
I have used TDM many times with less problems than some of the newer and more recent Dromed made missions.
I am more of a player than a game editor, but I have toyed with the editor that came with TDS and probably like the design at least in gameplay for TDM better than TDS, but have not really tried it's editor so I can not make any fair judgement on that.
I really do appreciate the FMs made with it so far, and Illusionist's Tower is also one of my favorites in TDM.
I honestly think that TDM is pretty darn awesome, and best of all is the way it has been distributed.
As stated above your TDM engine works as well as TDM and the graphics are really quite appealing. Load time for a map is the only thing I have an issue with because of my slower machine, so alot of my game playing time is spent playing older T2 missions because of speed and some really good game play.
Hopefully I will be able to remedy this with a new machine soon, but it would be hard for me to part with a machine I made from scratch.
Springheel on 31/3/2015 at 01:34
Quote Posted by Jaime Lannister
Which one is this? "Illusionist's Tower"? I really liked that one.
Yes, that's the one I was thinking of. There's another one that's kind of mystical and abstract, but I can't remember what it's called atm.
Quote:
I hope you're not talking about "A Night to Remember". That mission has been broken since before 2.03 and you know this. Are you talking about a different one?
No, I'm talking about that one. That was a response to the claim that TDM mappers all create the same kind of maps--I'm not sure what the fact that it currently needs fixing has to do with anything.
Jaime Lannister on 31/3/2015 at 02:18
Quote Posted by Springheel
No, I'm talking about that one. That was a response to the claim that TDM mappers all create the same kind of maps--I'm not sure what the fact that it currently needs fixing has to do with anything.
I only mention it because it just seems a bit disingenuous to advertise the existence of a mission and neglect to mention that it's been unplayable for months. Anyone reading your post could have thought, "A murder mystery TDM mission! That sounds good! I want to play that," only to find that it's broken and the author has stepped down from TDM editing for an undetermined amount of time.
Nitpicking aside, I will also vouch for the other missions that Springheel mentioned, which I'm pretty sure are "Reap As You Sow," "Requiem," "Pandora's Box," and "The Creeps," respectively (and they are all quite good, I would add).
Springheel on 31/3/2015 at 13:28
Quote Posted by Jaime Lannister
I only mention it because it just seems a bit disingenuous to advertise the existence of a mission and neglect to mention that it's been unplayable for months.
It's not "disingenuous" at all, since the discussion was about what types of missions TDM mappers choose to create, and not about what missions currently need fixing.
I'm still curious about my previous question, though...anyone know the approximate percentage of T2 FMs that would be considered "non-standard"?
Ricebug on 31/3/2015 at 17:02
Quote Posted by Springheel
I'm still curious about my previous question, though...anyone know the approximate percentage of T2 FMs that would be considered "non-standard"?
Since I've written walkthroughs on every T2 FM ever released, I'll insert foot into mouth and guess that probably 1% of said missions are what you'd consider non-standard.
[INDENT]
*
DooM and
Strife! are remakes of other games.
* Some of Sluggs's missions, such as the
Bestest series come to mind.
* Filling the sc-fi genre, you have
4th Planet (Independent Thief)
Space Thief (William the Taffer) and Sliptip's
Escape from the Planet of the Robots.
* Toss in the Christmas missions and a couple of concept FMs (
Snowball Fight, by Yandros)
[/INDENT]
I worked many years with the Radiant editor, and even pestered Robert Duffy (one of iD Software's QeRadiant programmers) while writing tutorials for the thing (found on the old Rust site). I say that to say this: I prefer Dromed-ing. I found that DarkRadiant has changed quite a bit from the Quake III days, and it seemed fairly difficult to make even a simple mission. Doing the actual map is easy; it's the other crap you have to assemble that's a PITA.
Renault on 31/3/2015 at 19:45
Quote Posted by Ricebug
I found that DarkRadiant has changed quite a bit from the Quake III days, and it seemed fairly difficult to make even a simple mission. Doing the actual map is easy; it's the other crap you have to assemble that's a PITA.
Just curious, but what do you consider to be the "other crap?" I've never released a TDM mission, but I've dabbled quite a bit, and I've always found the editor was extremely easy to work with. Much simpler than Dromed in some ways.
I've always assumed that Dromeders who decided not to edit for TDM made that decision because they just preferred the Thief asset set over the TDM one, as opposed to them thinking that Dark Radiant was difficult to work with.
