Fidcal on 16/2/2006 at 15:35
This is the most exciting development since Thief 2 was launched, both for level developers and players alike. Many of you already know about it but many will not - or will have heard the name but not realize the implications. There are lots of postings here at ttlg but many are about one small aspect or a passing reference so you might just skip over.
In July, 2004, I posted a list (
http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1088933#post1088933) HERE of what TDS (Thief 3) had omitted from the core Thief experience. The Dark Mod (TDM) is specifically aiming to redress what TDS had neglected to include - and more!
Now Dark Mod is a level development toolkit for stealth fan missions of the Thief type but will be released with a mini campaign to play plus possibly other missions. So whereas Thief 2 was released as a game with the editor as an extra, Dark Mod will be kind of the other way round. The main game and the mission creation kit will not be Garrett-based nor will it be Garrett's world. But inspired by that world, it WILL be so close in type that fan mission developers will be able to create pure Garrett missions if they wish. [edit: differing only in that gameplay will be pure Dark Mod. Also note copyright should be considered in some countries] However, it seems more likely to me the story themes will be more generalised though still within the stealth, medieval/Victorian fantasy feel.
Whereas TDS was pushed and pulled by funding and desire for profit, TDM springs from the pure centre of the Thief community and a desire to express the essential Thief environment as closely as possible in a much more up-to-date game engine and share it with everyone else. It is the ultimate dream future for all who enjoy Thief. And whereas TDS uses the Unreal software engine, TDM will use the Doom3 core. Now, don't reach for that Next button! The game Doom 3 in no way indicates what is possible with a stealth game built using a modfied form of the same engine.
It is being developed at (
http://www.thedarkmod.com/) and though we might get lucky and have something by the end of this year, I am realistically expecting the first release next year in 2007. The website and the forums there are packed with info and makes good reading. But because the information is necessarily fragmented, I thought a summary would be useful. All the following is what I have gleaned from the Dark Mod website where I have been lurking for a few days, stunned and speechless. Feel free to correct me if I have made any mistakes or missed anything and I might re-edit so we have a reference.
Whether you play or wish to create Dark Mod fan missions you will need...
1. The Doom 3 game itself which also includes a level editor.
Additionally you might try an open-source editor: GTKradiant from (
www.qeradiant.com).
[edit: The GTK editor is recommended as it continues to be improved and a TDM plugin is planned]
You can of course, practice immediately to create Doom maps and add your own textures, etc.
2. [EDIT] Ensure the 1.3 upgrade is installed which is contained in the 1.2 patch.
3. [EDIT: There is one report of a problem if not full screen but another that it is fine in Win2K SP4. If you should have
any difficulty then consider the following] For full screen, in doomconfig.cfg, put: r_fullscreen 0
or, make a shortcut to Doom3.exe and put this to get the editor into fullscreen automatically on start:
(path to doom3)\Doom3.exe +r_fullscreen 0 +seta com_AllowConsole 1 +editor +set sv_pure 0 +set fs_game darkmod +vid_restart
4. [EDIT : An alpha/beta test of Dark Mod might possibly be available by the end of 2006 or into 2007. No date set for a working development
package or the official mini-campaign.]
GAME PROVIDED:
A multi-mission mini campaign launched with the development toolkit
Basic theme not Thief but thief-like with a medaeval/Victorian feel
(though you will be able to create/play pure Garrett levels if you want)
Campaign will include a city/rooftop level!
PLAYER:
1st person view. 3rd p.view an engine feature but not supported so might not work.
NO 'body-awareness' (visible arms/legs) as in TDS but could be added
crawling - probably not.
NO-multi-player but could be added
other sounds obscure player sounds, eg can't hear loud footsteps in engine room
Light/Shade interaction like T1/2 with an *optional* Light gem
silhouette detection was considered but rejected.[EDIT]
Player, AI & objects with shadows onto terrain AND objects. AI Detectable?
INTERFACE:
Objectives system more like T1/2 than T3
Time-based objectives might be supported
Secrets will be supported
More customizable, including no HUD if preferred.
Item selection : minimal screen size (somewhat like T1/2?)
Weapons/ammo store of the T1/T2 pre-mission type
MOVEMENT:
Mantling, including mantling into a crouch-only space
reverse-mantling being considered (silent lowering?)
True leaning (not like TDS side step)
Swimming and diving
Wall-flattening considered but rejected.
Run, walk, crouch, etc details being developed
WEAPONS:
blackjack: action more like T1/2 but much improved visually
short sword (T2 moves + hopefully stab(thrust))
NO dagger
broadhead, water, moss, fire, gas,noise, and ROPE arrows.
holy water to bless water arrows
Speed potions : unlikely
Gas Mines : probably
No oil flasks
OBJECTS & TOOLS:
lock-picking: options: auto(T2) or advanced & alerts guards
stackable, climbable crates, etc.
Advanced text readables with variable fonts and graphics
NO scouting orbs (camera grenades) (I think)
AI:
AI: guards, Thieves' Guild, priests, pagans, victorian scientists
No 'keepers' as this is not Thief but thief-like but you could add them!
Non-human : robots, zombies, undead, spiders(wall-climb I think)
Non-human : belchers (gaseous burrick-like lizards that also bite)
Creatures : Two-legs, 6-legs, 8-legs, & wings, eg, bats, birds, no 4-legs likely
True rag-doll physics for collapsing AI - not spineless like TDS!
Some stealthy AI planned
AI behaviour modifiable with simple scripting
AI behaviour improved, eg, after major alert might not relax so readily.
guards climbing ladders? NOT planned but probably addable.
NO lip synch but some jaw movement.
NO AI waking after BJ cos would encourage kill instead (but addable later)
NO spawning of AI (but addable)
SOUND & GRAPHIC EFFECTS:
sound propogation like T1/2
Animated skies, moon, stars, clouds
Improved weather (rain, fog) - not planned at start but can be added
Improved particle effects possible
Swimmable water that wobbles and ripples
glass warping effects, eg frosted or ribbed glass
in-game cut-scene videos.
Reflective surfaces, eg, polished floor.
Bump-mapping (surface indentations lit/shaded according to light)
MISC:
max level size will be larger than TDS, possibly bigger than T1/2
Code will be open-source so no restrictions on 3rd party mods and expandability
Stims/responses concept planned
Multi-zone games a future possibility with data passed between zones
Any texture can be used as a transparency to filter coloured lighting effects on to a surface
Check out some of the excellent screens including this Thief model at...
(
http://www.pixelwerks.be/pictures/pages/thief1.htm)
TDS is good - but we want more than good, right? We want TDM. Go there, bookmark it, and be ready! :thumb:
sparhawk on 16/2/2006 at 19:11
Quote Posted by Fidcal
This is the most exciting development since Thief 2 was launched, both for level developers and players alike.
Thanks. :)
Even though it is high praise there are some error in your ummary that need to be fixed. :)
Quote:
But inspired by that world, it WILL be so close in type that fan mission developers will be able to create pure Garrett missions if they wish.
Even though you can name your hero Garrett, it doesn't really matter, as that alone doesn't change gameplay. It also may not be a wise move, but that depends on your particular country. In some countries this might call a copyright infringment claim down on you and in others it may not.
Quote:
1. The Doom 3 game itself which also includes a level editor.
Additionally you might try an open-source editor: GTKradiant from (
www.qeradiant.com).
In the long unr it will probably be advisable to use the GtkEditor, as it is constantly improved upon and offers some advatnages. DoomEdit is pretty static and doesn't get changed over time. We also plan to do a plugin for visual configuration of the maps, specific for TDM, and this plugin will only work in GtkRadiant.
Quote:
2. Ensure the 1.1 patch is installed else the SDK code will not work.
Actually it requires the 1.3 upgrade which is contained in the 1.2 patch (I think).
Quote:
3. There are problems if not full screen. For full screen, in doomconfig.cfg, put: r_fullscreen 0
I do my development all the time in windowed mode and it works fine (W2K SP4). I'm not aware of any problems related to the screenmode.
Quote:
4. The Dark Mod toolkit due possibly end 2006 or 2007. This will include a mini campaign in the thiefly style.
This is definitely wrong. Even though we hope to have something releasable by the end of this year, this would be AT MOST a kind of public alpha/beta test. And it definitely will NOT include a campaign at this time as there is certainly no time right now to create a campaign as well as the toolkit in that timeframe.
We will certainly try to create maps that feature individual gameplay elements so that the player can explore what TDM can do.
Quote:
1st person view. 3rd person 'might' work but not supported
3rd person works, because it is an engine feature and we are not intentionaly remove it. However we are not actively supporting it either, so there is no guarantee that it will work.
Quote:
silhouette detection being considered
Currently not. We discussed it, and we have code that could made to do this in a limited way, but we decided against it for gamebalancing reasons.
Quote:
Fully reflective mirrors? Not clear as player has no animated body?
The player will be visible in mirrors but not in the gameworld (unless in 3rd person of course).
Quote:
Wall-flattening being considered
nope.
