catbarf on 27/2/2018 at 18:47
Black market trade, yes. 'My state is too restrictive so I'll just hop the border and legally buy whatever I want', no, which was my understanding of what Pyrian was saying.
nickie on 27/2/2018 at 18:56
A constitutional lawyer on the 2nd amendment starting at 28:10. (I know how to set the start for 18s but damned if I can work out 28 minutes and 10 seconds.)
I know CNN has its own slant but I found it interesting and learnt quite a bit, hopefully things that are true.
[video=youtube_share;8YPPTnjPHzM]https://youtu.be/8YPPTnjPHzM?t[/video]
Pyrian on 27/2/2018 at 19:16
I meant it was easy, not necessarily legal, sorry if that wasn't clear.
SlyFoxx on 27/2/2018 at 19:30
There seem to be people that think the 2nd Amendment is somehow antiquated. That now we have police, military and other armed federal agencies and that THEY have the guns so the average Joe doesn't need one. I pointed out that a fat lot of good the 4 BCSO officers did hiding, guns drawn behind their car in the parking lot while some nut was shooting up the place.
Contrast that with the action of (civilian) Stephen Willeford last (IIRC) November in Texas. The First Baptist Church shooting in Sutherland Springs. After hearing shots he grabbed his AR-15 and a handful of bullets ran from his house without putting on shoes. Found and confronted the shooter, exchanged fire successfully hitting the dirt bag who jumped into his truck and sped off. Willeford flagged down a male motorist and the two gave chase eventually catching up to the dirt bag and held him at gun point until authorities arrived. As I recall Willeford is an NRA instructor.
If you want to hear the whole anecdote...
[video=youtube;B4HEchh0XD8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4HEchh0XD8&t=0s&index=14&list=PLtf0BFulL6_XHn6jAVcmegw0tTmI1qT2V[/video]
heywood on 27/2/2018 at 20:23
Nit picking here: The shooting was over and the shooter walked out of the church and that's when Willeford fired on him. And Willeford didn't catch him and hold him at gun point. During the car chase, the shooter ran off the road into a ditch and shot himself. Yeah, it's still heroic though.
To me, the Sutherland Springs massacre is not an example of how an armed civilian can prevent a mass shooting. It's an example of how a failure in the background check system can lead to a mass shooting. The shooter was convicted in an Air Force court martial of domestic assault. That should have popped up in the background check and disqualified him, but the Air Force never entered a record of the conviction into the federal database. He had also previously applied for a license to carry and was rejected. He shouldn't have been able to buy the guns he used in the shooting.
I'm also curious to know how many gun carrying vigilantes saved lives by using their weapons versus how many unnecessarily shot or killed someone: like George Zimmerman, or Bernhard Goetz, (
https://www.propublica.org/article/post-katrina-white-vigilantes-shot-african-americans-with-impunity) or these guys.
SlyFoxx on 27/2/2018 at 22:57
Good points heywood. No rational people want nuts jobs to have guns. Government's first duty is to protect its citizens. This latest nut job (I won't use his name) in FL is just another example of law enforcement dropping the ball. There was plenty of just cause for his arrest before the massacre and authorities failed to act. That I don't want to give up more of my freedoms to government that more and more fails to achieve a minimum standard of competence should not come as a surprise.
Renzatic on 27/2/2018 at 23:31
It's funny how all it takes is a decade to change some perspectives. When Katrina hit, and I saw all the people bitching over the looters vs. foragers fiasco, I assumed it was much ado over nothing. I saw it as two different newspapers running two different articles written by two different authors covering two different, albeit superficially similar stories. The fact that one group was black and the other white was merely an unfortunate coincidence. I figured that, were the roles switched, the white people would've been labeled as looters just as readily.
People looking for racial issues where there are none, I thought. Nothing to see here.
Recent events have changed my outlook accordingly. Now, I see these past responses as outrage for the sake of outrage, but as the water trickling between the cracks in the concrete, an unheeded warning that the dam was about to break.
Renzatic on 27/2/2018 at 23:46
Quote Posted by SlyFoxx
Good points heywood. No rational people want nuts jobs to have guns. Government's first duty is to protect its citizens. This latest nut job (I won't use his name) in FL is just another example of law enforcement dropping the ball. There was plenty of just cause for his arrest before the massacre and authorities failed to act. That I don't want to give up more of my freedoms to government that more and more fails to achieve a minimum standard of competence should not come as a surprise.
I'm not gonna say that the FBI and local police don't share some of the fault in this. Nor do I think this is a perfect excuse to write out the 2nd Amendment wholesale.
But I'm not going to say that it's solely the fault of law enforcement to act. The FBI receives roughly 1300 phone calls a day, most of them some random upstanding citizen reporting that some person, group, or other is going to shoot/blow up/sternly lecture a large group of people. Local police are in about the same boat, generally understaffed and overworked, only able to address what they consider real threats looming in the immediate future in a timely manner. Considering all the rumors, hearsay, and other bullshit that gets thrown their way on a daily basis, it's no real surprise that law enforcement, both local and federal, let something like this pass them by on occasion.
I think the real question that lies at the heart of everything is why is it that we've become such a massive, seathing ball of aimless, reactionary hatred over the last couple of decades.
Vae on 28/2/2018 at 02:08
[video=youtube;8hyQDQPEsrs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hyQDQPEsrs[/video]
