They may take away our lives, but they'll never take our freedom! - by Lazarus411
Lazarus411 on 17/10/2012 at 23:15
This is all the fault of Braveheart isn't it? Either way I don't care if Scotland gets freedom, I mean independence or not. They have already served their useful purpose.
Al_B on 17/10/2012 at 23:56
Quote Posted by Lazarus411
They have already served their useful purpose.
This could be a
very short thread.
Vivian on 18/10/2012 at 00:03
I don't really see why they want it, but sure, whatever, go be scottish, but harder. I hope it doesn't mean whiskey is going to get more expensive.
june gloom on 18/10/2012 at 00:12
Quote Posted by Al_B
This could be a
very short thread.
i expect nothing less from a lazarus411 thread
i expect nothing more, too
SubJeff on 18/10/2012 at 08:32
It'd be a real shame if they did become independent imho, but I think it right they get to vote on it.
I don't think there are enough ultra nationalists for independence though. Sure there are proud nationalists, and rightly so, but I think Mr Scottish Salmon is going to be disappointed.
I've never understood the Scottish dislike of the English. We don't hate them so...
Lazarus411 on 18/10/2012 at 10:22
Quote Posted by Al_B
This could be a
very short thread.
Well, it's more or less the truth. It would be no great loss economically to the rest of Britain to lose Scotland. In fact I think we'd be better off overall.
Vivian on 18/10/2012 at 10:25
Yeah, apart from all the 90% of north sea oil and gas that would belong to scotland.
Ulukai on 18/10/2012 at 10:25
But then where would we keep our Nuclear Wessels? :D
I think it would be a great shame if it were to happen, it seems mainly driven by the massive chip on Alex Salmond's shoulder and I'm not sure whose interest it is supposed to be in, other than Salmond's ego. And on a practical note I do not think he has fully thought through the seizmic Economic implications.
Not least of which, they would then be tied to a currency (Sterling or even worse, the Euro) over which they have little or no control.
As we've seen lately, you cannot have a single currency with a one-size fits all Interest Rate without big trouble because for example, Germany & Greece have very different economies.
Al_B on 18/10/2012 at 11:56
Quote Posted by Lazarus411
It would be no great loss economically to the rest of Britain to lose Scotland. In fact I think we'd be better off overall.
I was just having a dig at you since you'd essentially dismissed an entire nation as no longer serving a purpose. I even thought you were joking yourself! I don't think the economic imbalance is as clear-cut as it's made out to be but as a Scot living in Scotland I'm bound to say that ;)
Quote Posted by Subjective Effect
I think Mr Scottish Salmon is going to be disappointed.
I certainly hope so. Whatever may be gained by the ability to control taxes, for example, would be lost by not having control over currency as Ulukai points out. There is already a strong Scottish National Identity which can co-exist as part of being part of the UK and it already has a separate legal and education system.
Quote Posted by Subjective Effect
I've never understood the Scottish dislike of the English. We don't hate them so...
Whilst there are definitely some Nationalists (just as there are English Nationalists) I think you'll find there's very little hostility towards the English that goes farther than the type of banter that goes on between "Northerners" and "Southerners" in England.
Ulukai on 18/10/2012 at 15:54
Really, Salmond never wanted this vote, he just wants more power for Scotland.
BUT, it's not democratic to just ask Scotland if they should have more power, so you have to ask the whole of the UK. He'd never win a referendum asking, "Shall we give more power to Scotland?" when asking the UK as a whole so instead, if you only want to ask the Scots for their opinion then you have to ask instead, "Should Scotland have independence?"
Now, for Cameron this is great because if Scotland say yes then suddenly the Conservative party have a higher share of the seats in Parliament (maybe a majority? I haven't done the calculation) If they say No, then the matter is a closed book and he can just turn around to Salmond and tell him the people don't want it and to go away. Forever.
Even if Scotland does get independence, how are we going to divvy up the National Debt? What about the NHS? What about the cost of divvying this up? Who's going to pay for that? English / Welsh / NI taxpayers are going to be up in arms if it involves them paying for it, you can bet. Does Scotland become part of Europe automatically? Don't all new entrants to Europe have to use the Euro? What about the UN Security Council? Is independent Scotland part of that? Would they need to renegotiate? So many questions, which although some people may have answers or theories for just haven't been thought about in government. Or if they have, there's no evidence of this thought process being discussed in any kind of sufficient detail.
So, I predict: Not going to happen. But if it does: chaos, bad things.
