West on 14/1/2010 at 18:39
Evening ladies and gents, this is my very first post as I've just joined the forum, though I have been reading the posts for around about hmmmm god knows how many years now. I didn't think there was a bigger fan of Thief than me out there but I maybe wrong though judging from some posts and accomplishments on this forum. So where better than to ask for some real help???
Well, after brutally beating all 3 games to death with a blackjack for the last 7 or 8 years, I decided to attempt the famous Lytha style
Thief 1 went smoothly, as the 0 damage rule did not say anything about not letting guards know you are there, so luring guards away from their posts was easy enough...but after finishing thief 1 like that, I felt something was missing from my game, and decided that lytha style isn't really "ghosting" so to speak...so I'm playing through Thief 2 on expert trying NOT to let anyone become alert to my presence (not even noisemaker arrows or other distractions), no blackjacking, no violence, not bothering about grabbing maximum loot, just getting in, getting the job done and getting out without anyone knowing I was ever there. And to add to that realism I've downloaded the ultimate difficulty mod that someone created, a great mod that you all probably already know about...couple of situations pissed me off though, wondering how the pro's would deal with them...
1) Life of the Party - The annoying guard on the balcony opposite the other side of the bank, usually I can slip by him, but with the ultimate difficulty mod he collars me every time...any ideas? can i get by em all without them turning me into a human porcupine?
2) Life of the Party - Those 2 ho's (lady can't-remember-her-name's suite) with one of them stood constantly facing the only way you can go to get to the mechanist tower, out her window, can't slip by her unless I use an invisibility potion...and then I've gotta get back too, and leaves me without my potion for...
3) Life of the Party - ...that BASTARD!!!!! outside Karras' office! How the Hucking Fell am I supposed to ghost my way past him!!?? I read a scroll that said the guard outside the office was changed every hour, and patiently waited in the shadow for him to change...all bloody night. Didn't happen, wasted 5 packs of doritos and half a bottle of pepsi staying up to see if he'd bugger off. Any pro's got any creative ways of getting rid of him or getting past him, without using noisy arrows, bags of spanners, trails of robot porn or biffs to the head??
4) Kidnap - yeah ok, Cavador has to be KO'd, but any seriously pimpin' cadillac drivin ho exploitin playaz got any ideas about the 2 gayboys that follow him around everywhere? anyway I can get that turd cavador away from em without getting them all randy and wanting to stick their maces up my uranus? (and without KOing them of course...)
as for soulforge, im kinda startin to think I might just give the ghostin a miss. bloody turret room...
And also, I was wonderin... of the very few things that p me off about thief, the biggest thing is the way the guards state "tawt i saw somefin..." without actually having a look to see what it is...or heard...TDS fixed this, but it would be great if someone had created a mod that enabled them to do this for TDP and TMA, add to the realism...anyone know of a mod that does this?
Thanks guys, hope one of you experts can enlighten me
PotatoGuy on 14/1/2010 at 19:14
Quote Posted by West
3) Life of the Party - ...that BASTARD!!!!! outside Karras' office! How the Hucking Fell am I supposed to ghost my way past him!!??
I have no idea. I don't want to count the times I tried it. Getting behind him wasn't so hard, but the doors open to the outside, and he is just too close to the doors to pass through. Maybe someone else knows a way...
Quote Posted by West
4) Kidnap - yeah ok, Cavador has to be KO'd, but any seriously pimpin' cadillac drivin ho exploitin playaz got any ideas about the 2 gayboys that follow him around everywhere?
My no-KO method was (stole it from someone else though): Make sure they are on a place without many patrols. Hide in the shadows and let them pass. Shoot a noisemaker arrow in the direction they are walking to. The first guard always investigates, Cavador and the other guard run back to where they were coming from. Lean forward from the shadows and blackjack Cavador, while making sure you don't bump in the other guard. After some seconds that guard will join the first guard in searching. Meanwhile, pick up Cavador and get away from that place.
Hope that's of at least some use, and welcome to the forums by the way! :D
EDIT: Though there are many ghosters at ttlg, the real 'hardcore group' is at the Eidos forums. Maybe they can help as well.
West on 14/1/2010 at 19:58
eidos forum, i'll give those guys a go, thanks. i thought it was the end of the world when my xbox caught the anal red ring disease, until i found my old beloved thief collection.
for cavador, you maybe right, that's probably the best way around it. i did contemplate a flashbomb or flashmine, knock him out and run off before the others regain vision, but then that still alerts them to my presence...i guess the game is technically "unghostable", unless i can find some other way
I'm gonna stab that friggin office guard in the knee with a rusty fork!
Hexameron on 14/1/2010 at 21:58
I posted this in your Eidos thread, but I'll repeat it here in case you're over on TTLG more often.
There is a great archived thread, (
http://forums.eidosgames.com/old-ubb/Thief_2_Ghost_Perfect_Thief_Results_1.htm) Thief 2 Ghost/Perfect Thief Results that has reports and discussion about ghosting Thief 2 OMs. If you want to know how the pros have dealt with ghosting Thief 2 back in 2000, that's the thread for you.
Quote:
Life of the Party - The annoying guard on the balcony
I have not tried ghosting T2 with the Ultimate Difficulty Mod - I'm not that masochistic ;). It's been a long time since I've played LotP, but you may not be able to ghost it with the UDM.
Quote:
Life of the Party - Those 2 ho's (lady can't-remember-her-name's suite) with one of them stood constantly facing the only way you can go to get to the mechanist tower,
Check the 5th post down on (
http://forums.eidosgames.com/old-ubb/Thief_2_Ghost_Perfect_Thief_Results_3.htm) this thread for Sneak's amazing Nudge technique. By pressing and moving against an idle AI, you can effectively move them forward. Sneak used it to bypass those ladies and many ghosters have since utilized it. It's a game exploit no doubt, but I consider it a ghoster's tool of trade, especially when encountering AI that block your path.
Quote:
outside Karras' office! Any pro's got any creative ways of getting rid of him or getting past him
See the above link for nudging him.
Quote:
Kidnap - yeah ok, Cavador
The honor once again goes to Sneak for his (
http://forums.eidosgames.com/old-ubb/Thief_2_Ghost_Perfect_Thief_Results_1.htm) "train wrecking" crate-hook technique. He basically used crates to separate the two mechs and keep them isolated while Cavador continued along his route alone.
Quote:
as for soulforge, im kinda startin to think I might just give the ghostin a miss. bloody turret room...
Look for Roobarb's post (
http://forums.eidosgames.com/old-ubb/Thief_2_Ghost_Perfect_Thief_Results_2.htm) here. He doesn't mention the turrets, but I'm sure this OM is ghostable. It's not a fun mission to ghost by any stretch, but it's possible.
Quote:
And also, I was wonderin... of the very few things that p me off about thief, the biggest thing is the way the guards state "tawt i saw somefin..." without actually having a look to see what it is...or heard...TDS fixed this, but it would be great if someone had created a mod that enabled them to do this for TDP and TMA, add to the realism...anyone know of a mod that does this?
I'm not aware of such a mod. I don't think many in the Thief community would agree that TDS "fixed" anything; quite the contrary. Does not seeing a T1 guard's head pivot really break the realism? To me, T1/T2 look and play far more realistically than the cartoonish TDS AI. Just KO a TDS guard and watch him bend backwards like a cirque du soleil freak and tell me I'm wrong :D.
West on 14/1/2010 at 22:52
yep, i got the 1 on the eidos forum, thanks hex!
and thanks potatoguy!!
any of you guys hear of any new tricks about getting past AIs who can't move because they've stapled themselves to the floor, let me know. Peace!
jtr7 on 14/1/2010 at 23:11
Un-nudge-ables?
West on 15/1/2010 at 09:19
yup.like the one outside karras' office...maybe you can nudge him, but the fact that theres another mechanist constantly patrolling alongside him, coming in and out the door opposite him, makes it a pain in the neck to shift him. besides, i dont like nudging
maybe sometimes rules are their to be broken. i dont think theres any way past him without use of blackjack, gas, nudging or noisy distractions or brutal violence
Platinumoxicity on 15/1/2010 at 14:26
The guard opposite the bank is easy, just shoot a moss arrow behind him and run past him quickly enough to not alert the guard at the bank balcony.
The office guardian is impossible when you don't exploit any bugs, so I distract him someway. I don't play exactly according to ghosting rules anyway. It's not like I get any kicks out of exhausting myself by making things too hard. ;)
West on 15/1/2010 at 16:30
Yeah, I did manage to get past him, but then I come across problem no.2, which is I've gotta go behind that same problematic guard to get to the opposite building, and then the one at the bank always sees me as I try to dash across the back of him...but I might have a way round that, gonna try some crate collecting, and skip the whole shabaz by hopping onto a nearby roof and strollin past em all, before givin em the one fingured salute when I see the back of em...will have to acquire enough crates for the journey back that means though
got an idea for the office guard! will take a lotta work though
1)use my mechanical eye to zoom in on the mechanist and read his nametag
2)break into mechanist personnel records storage and find out the name of the guards next of kin
3)pay a courier to deliver a note to angelwatch to the guard, stating his next of kin has become involved in a horrific accident involving a sentry bots cannon launcher, his chocolate rearguard and a flask of extra slippy oil from TDS
4)watch him run off duty to be at the side of his poor robotically violated wife/mother/daughter/cat (me-ouch!!)
5)hey presto! an unguarded office door!
oh, and by the way...whatever DID happen to the Rothchilds invitation to the mechanist ball? any suggestions? I think the pagans intercepted it as revenge for the cutting down of trees for paper. that THAT Mechanists!!!
