DexterUndefine on 25/6/2008 at 04:46
Quote Posted by Tos
No server list yet. I don't think I'll be looking at implementing something like that until I'm sure that multiplayer will work well enough to be worth it. Connecting to games is done through a console window that's attached to the game's process right now, and you do need to type in the IP.
Hmm, I guess you're right about the console method, surely adding a server list would mean to modify the gamesys file :tsktsk:
Quote Posted by Tos
Events that exit the game mode (such as hitting the escape key or reading a book) are handled the same way in Thief as they are in System Shock -- it does pause the game. Disabling this would be fairly trivial, though.
Quote Posted by Ravus
I think if you disable the game pausing when you read books it could be good for the coop. One person watching anothers back while he's reading.
I don't mean to brag, I like the idea but what would happen to the player that is reading a book/papyrus/journal ends up getting attacked by a guard (even though a coop thief is looking out for you) or getting hurt by something else? Will that cancel out the reading and resuming back to game?
Anyways, keep up the good work Tos, you have my support! :thumb:
The Magpie on 25/6/2008 at 05:56
This is interesting. What could be the motivation for pausing the game while reading in the original Thief design? I mean, if anything it's a bad case of destroying the immersion we all have come to tout so highly around here.
My only guess is that the designers thought the texts and books mattered enough that one should always be able to take one's time reading them without fear of ambush. Were not the game paused, the player would perhaps have been much more tempted to habitually skip the texts.
I'm not sure what kinds of effects this would have in a co-op game, there are pros and cons, but for pvp mutual pausing would be downright silly. Not that this project concentrates on theftmatches yet.
--
L.
sNeaksieGarrett on 26/6/2008 at 16:08
I think you're right the magpie. Although, you could just find a spot to hide, and then start reading.. oh wait, that only would work for scrolls.:(
Try playing doom 3 and reading your PDA. You better be out of harms way!:o
RavynousHunter on 27/6/2008 at 18:51
Please don't roast me alive on this one, as I'm still something of a DromEd noob, but would there be a way to alter the gamesys to make the natural state of a book similar to that of a scroll? If it is, then you could remove the game pause and people would just have to look for a safe place to read for a while. Then again... If you get whacked, it should immediately take you out of the "book mode" and let you run like someone just set you on fire.
sNeaksieGarrett on 27/6/2008 at 19:12
I'm sure you could (i.e. put a StdScroll script and alter frobinfo), but there again lies the problem of it still pausing the game. Whether you pick up a scroll or frob a book, the end result is always going to an alternate screen that "pauses" the game. The only workaround to this is things like plaques where text appears at the top of your screen instead of pausing the game. Except, I wouldn't do that for books because they'd be too long.:o Hmmm.... any dromeders got ideas?
vort on 27/6/2008 at 19:46
I'm pretty sure it would be trivial to kill pausing for certain things with the hook.
on a side not, it might be possible to patch whichever .gam is loaded by the game with the necessary changes to play multiplayer on runtime, there's a few problems with it though so it may not happen. If it works, theoretically any FM should work, aside from problems presented by the missions themselves (such as one I saw where you don't start with the blackjack and need to find it later, I'm assuming there's only one.)
We tried out a few last night but neither of us have ever been big on FMs, so I was wondering which of them do you guys think would be best to try out with 2-3 people? (a friend of ours has been playing sometimes, 3 people on Ambush is a little pointless though)
demagogue on 27/6/2008 at 20:15
So you want to try some non-linear, "work-sharing-friendly" FMs, right? I'd say - Equilibrium, Art of Theft, Lord Alan's Factory, Left for Dead, Christine's FMs
Some of the big "narrative" FMs would be good to check too ... Ominous Bequest (must pick up blackjack), Broken Triad, Rowena's Curse, Seven Sisters ... Gaetane's FMs.
And definitely the "classics" ... Calendra's Legacy, Seventh Crystal ...
Well, that's a good start.
sNeaksieGarrett on 27/6/2008 at 20:21
I'd recommend playing Yandros' fantastic Hammerite deathmatch.:cheeky: Though I'm not sure how you could make it work with more than one player. You may have to talk to Yandros and see if you can work a multiplayer version out.
If I'm understanding your meaning vort, it may be "trivial" (unimportant) to you, but when you are playing with multiple people online, it's annoying to have to wait for one guy to stop reading something... the lack of pausing makes more sense in multiplayer games.
I know thief gold is not supported, but I was curious if there may be a way to try this "hook" on thief gold. As I mentioned many pages back, I found out that thief gold has multiplayer code in the EXE as well, but it appears to be much less so than thief2.exe. They (LGS I mean) were certainly considering multiplayer on thief gold as well.
vort on 27/6/2008 at 21:18
I meant it should be easy to stop it from pausing the game under certain circumstances. Not the best choice of words, I know.
As for Thief Gold, it should be possible to get it working but it all depends on how much of the code is still there, and it would be better to get T2 working as much as possible before going looking into TG, so that we know more about what would need to be done.
Tos on 27/6/2008 at 21:48
I think it's safe to say that by the time this is released there will be no need for a modified gamesys. Nearly all of the changes that need to be made to it are now made through the hook as the current mission is being loaded. I believe that the only changes that actually need to be made by hand right now are a few to the Default Avatar objects, but I should be able to automate those as well.
Quote Posted by demagogue
So you want to try some non-linear, "work-sharing-friendly" FMs, right? I'd say - Equilibrium, Art of Theft, Lord Alan's Factory, Left for Dead, Christine's FMs ...
Thanks for the recommendations. We'll be trying a few of those today.
I should probably point out now though that the following things are likely to make an FM not work with the current build:
• Projectile objects that inherit from the "projectile" tree in the gamesys (as in a broadhead or noisemaker arrow, but not crystals) and melee weapons that inherit from "Weapons" cannot be picked up by any players in the game, so any objectives related to doing so will not be completable yet. This may be fixed soon for melee weapons, but I'm not sure about projectiles.
• Some lifts and elevators will not appear to move for any players other than the host. Only some types are affected, and we believe it has something to do with the scripts that they use. vort can probably elaborate on this.
• Heavy usage of scripts (particularly with the assumption that there will only be one player in the game) is likely to have unpredictable results in multiplayer. For example, in one of the fan missions we played last night I was able to simply run past a trapped area that fired arrows from the walls without triggering it whereas vort (who was hosting) was killed instantly by it.
In short, the fewer scripts and custom resources that the fan mission makes use of, the more likely it is to work.
Quote Posted by sNeaksieGarrett
If I'm understanding your meaning vort, it may be "trivial" (unimportant) to you, but when you are playing with multiple people online, it's annoying to have to wait for one guy to stop reading something... the lack of pausing makes more sense in multiplayer games.
I think he meant that it would be easy to do, which it would be.
Quote Posted by sNeaksieGarrett
I know thief gold is not supported, but I was curious if there may be a way to try this "hook" on thief gold. As I mentioned many pages back, I found out that thief gold has multiplayer code in the EXE as well, but it appears to be much less so than thief2.exe. They (LGS I mean) were certainly considering multiplayer on thief gold as well.
Getting multiplayer to work in Thief 2 (with the supposedly "complete" network code from SS2) has been so difficult that I don't even want to imagine what it would be like working with Thief Gold's unfinished netcode. :p
I'm afraid that the only way you'll be able to play through the Thief missions in multiplayer is by converting them to Thief 2 missions and playing them in the newer engine.
