Thief (4) Features. What we know is in, what we know is out. - by SubJeff
jtr7 on 2/5/2013 at 23:28
If EM hadn't said they got rid of the magic arrows and simple bow over credibility and plausibility issues, we wouldn't be mocking them so you could mock us. Put two and two together for once.
Nuth on 2/5/2013 at 23:37
Quote Posted by Dia
. Like they keep saying, they're 'reinventing' Thief, not making a sequel.
:(
They need to put that as a blurb on the box. "We disliked Thief so much, we just had to reinvent it!"
SubJeff on 2/5/2013 at 23:46
Quote Posted by jtr7
If EM hadn't said they got rid of the magic arrows and simple bow over credibility and plausibility issues, we wouldn't be mocking them so you could mock us. Put two and two together for once.
Where did they say this? They said lots of stuff but I don't think they said this.
Even if they did why not, errr, get a life?
Vivian on 2/5/2013 at 23:57
Christ, did someone drop a dickhead pill in your porridge or what?
Anyway SJ, water does put out fires. CO2 only puts out certain fires. Further evidence of my genius knack for looking up basic facts.
pavlovscat on 3/5/2013 at 00:00
Quote Posted by Dia
I thought that too, at first. But watching the video ((
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zi6OLeYs8fw)), Stephane Roy admits (at the 3:32 mark) that they're NOT making T4 '
just just just' for the Thief fans (because he claims that would be 'dangerous', which I still haven't a clue what he meant by that?).
Oh, that seems pretty clear to me. "Dangerous" surely means not profitable enough. They are already in too deep financially. They need to recoup as much as they can. Making a game just for Thief fans wouldn't be nearly as profitable as they need this game to be to save their asses. They need to appeal to
everyone. Good luck. :tsktsk:
SubJeff on 3/5/2013 at 00:10
They'll both put fires out, the question is how much you need and for how long.
But my point is - its academic. In the game it won't make that much difference will it? You could clean up blood with water arrows in Thief 1 and 2 (I never tried it in 3) but that's arguably even MORE ridiculous than putting out torches. Apart from that if Anti-fire Arrow version X works the same way why do we really care?
When it comes to "realism" in a Thief game it should, imho, extend to some things and not others - the arrows are special items that work somewhat outside the laws of physics. The physics of everything but the final effect should be in keeping with the real world; you have to carry them, they don't auto generate, they follow an arc when fired and that arc can't be 1 mile long, they break when they hit hard things, and that's it. None of the elemental arrow effects followed any kind of realistic physics in the past and we excuse them for reason X, which so far has been that they are elemental/magic. But even if they are supposedly based on some fancy steampunk tech (like the rope arrows in TDM) what, functionally, is the real difference?
EMs "reasons" for changing them are likely total bs. They just want some element of creative control in all likelihood - the freedom to say "these arrows work the same but they are different because of this thing that we came up with because we aren't just copying the old games". Its a small rebellion against being seen as copy and pastors. We may love the old games but we have to accept that no one wants to just re-do an old IP without tinkering. If the game plays just as well... why should we really care?
Hamadriyad on 3/5/2013 at 08:00
Quote Posted by Subjective Effect
But my point is - its academic. In the game it won't make that much difference will it? You could clean up blood with water arrows in Thief 1 and 2 (I never tried it in 3)
You can do that in TDS too. Actually in one of the side missions, you have to do that.
jtr7 on 3/5/2013 at 08:19
Yep.
Quote Posted by OQcleanupnote
Ramien-
I got a job for you. There's a guy I just killed. The body's on the second floor of the Bloody Ears Tavern. I need someone to go to Docks, and dispose of the body so's no one will ever find it. Drop it in the water around there. Any water'll do. There's a lotta blood that's gotta be cleaned up too. Oh, yeah, here's the most important thing. Don't let anyone see you carrying the body around. Don't let nobody see that body at all, get it? Just drop it in the water and clean up the blood. It's gotta get done tonight. I'll put some money in the drop box outside your place when the job is done for you to pay whoever you hire to do the dirty work.
Derk
PS - Don't taffin mess this up. It's important."
Quote Posted by OQbodyfound
Ramien you burrick brain-
I told you that no one should ever find that body! Well, it's been found. Or seen by somebody, I dunno. But I do know there's a whole investigation, City Watch and all! You're a dead man! If I ever see you around, you'll be sorry. Real sorry! I'm gonna pull your teeth out one by one, then stick a knife in your chest.
Derk
PS - I TOLD you not to taff it up!"
Each arrow has multiple uses. In TDS, you can additionally grow existing moss carpets with water arrows (it's quieter than firing another moss arrow, since TDS made them noisy, defeating the purpose), but since neither are used in Thief[4], oh well. I wonder if we'll have anyone disappointed they can't choke an AI with a moss arrow anymore? :laff:
I think you can increase the growth rate of the Pagan Sapling if you shoot it with water?
Without elementalism and the inherent pairing and opposites, EM has given themselves a lot of work reinventing the mechanics of the game. I hope the demo of gameplay was just incredibly borked (though I can't understand why it would be, so many years on).
And in all the games, except for plot-centric blood spills, the blood eventually goes away by itself, likewise the flinders from broken objects.
Back to Garrett's Old Quarter fence Ramien (who gets killed), if you clean up the bloody mess on Ramien's floor, it resets the following game day, like the library ghosts in Casing the Joint and Masks, no matter what happens in the library in Casing, it's reset in Masks.
Hamadriyad on 3/5/2013 at 08:43
Quote Posted by jtr7
Yep.
Each arrow has multiple uses. In TDS, you can additionally grow existing moss carpets with water arrows (it's quieter than firing another moss arrow, since TDS made them noisy, defeating the purpose), but since neither are used in Thief[4], oh well. I wonder if we'll have anyone disappointed they can't choke an AI with a moss arrow anymore? :laff:
I think you can increase the growth rate of the Pagan Sapling if you shoot it with water?
Hehe. :) I like how TDS adds new functions to elemental crystals. Though I don't know If we can increase the grow rate or not, I've never tried, but I wonder now.
Quote Posted by jtr7
Back to Garrett's Old Quarter fence Ramien who gets killed), if you clean up the bloody mess on Ramien's floor, it resets the following game day, like the library ghosts in Casing the Joint and Masks, no matter what happens in the library in Casing, it's reset in Masks.
Huh, I didn't know!
jtr7 on 3/5/2013 at 09:07
If I'm remembering right, I think I planted the Sapling, and then fired a water arrow at the ground it was set in as a half-joke. The games always had scenarios where, if the physics of the virtual world were complete, the elemental arrows would affect everything, even in a small way, but don't do anything to the world as we would expect them to, like how AIs don't react to water arrows at all, except for sound or maybe they notice a light go out, and wood doesn't burn unless it's firewood set for burning. So, I pretended to "water" the ground over the freshly-planted sapling, and I can't remember if I really saw it grow (just one stage of growth, with more arrows doing nothing), or if I just imagined what it might look like if it did. I only did it once back in 2006, so... Other than knowing for sure that it grows from game day to game day, I can't be certain without testing that it'll react to water arrows.
