Thief 4 vs. The Dark Mod - by Bulgarian_Taffer
rainynight65 on 1/6/2009 at 11:15
I find it interesting to the point of fascination how quickly people can make up their minds about something. It's like some posters here already know for a fact that Thief 4 will be a bad game and disappoint everyone. Based on a logo and two interviews - whoopee. You know what - if you want to be miserable about something, go and do it in your cellar. Don't crap your negative attitude all over the place. At this point in time, you don't know a thing about what the game will be like, so don't make as if you do. I will reserve judgement until I at least have a playable demo in my hands.
New Horizon on 1/6/2009 at 13:38
Quote Posted by rainynight65
I find it interesting to the point of fascination how quickly people can make up their minds about something. It's like some posters here already know for a fact that Thief 4 will be a bad game and disappoint everyone. Based on a logo and two interviews - whoopee. You know what - if you want to be miserable about something, go and do it in your cellar. Don't crap your negative attitude all over the place. At this point in time, you don't know a thing about what the game will be like, so don't make as if you do. I will reserve judgement until I at least have a playable demo in my hands.
Well, I think the disappointment of TDS helped people make up their minds a little faster this time. Commercialism has a way of making a cynic out of just about anyone. It's not as if 'you' know it's going to be a good game either...so, you know...I'm sure if it does rank up there with the quality of T1/2 that people will change their minds. Sorry man, but Ion Storm really did a great job burning the community for any future installments. Cut them some slack. You don't seem to realize that small details like a logo can sometimes go a long way in showing that a development studio really has their finger on the pulse of the fan base. From EM's reaction to the fans on the logo, they really don't seem to.
jay pettitt on 1/6/2009 at 13:45
Quote Posted by Brethren
Eh? No smilie there, so I'll assume you're serious? (somehow) :confused:
Sometimes it's good to read the words, not just look at the pictures. ;)
Renault on 1/6/2009 at 13:48
Quote Posted by jay pettitt
Sometimes it's good to read the words, not just look at the pictures. ;)
True enough - ouch, I'll consider myself zinged. :laff:
charpe6 on 1/6/2009 at 14:11
The biggest advantage of the Dark Mod over any commercial game will be the customization. I very much doubt Eidos will be like Bethesda and release a comprehensive world editor and allow you tweak much besides a few graphics annoyances like loot glint.
For some reason game developers like to drag their heels when it comes to modding. I guarantee you a game like Oblivion would not have been nearly as successful if it weren't for all the mods that came out that allowed you to change the mistakes of the developers into something fun. It baffles me why more developers don't follow Id and Bethesda's examples when it comes to moddable games.
New Horizon on 1/6/2009 at 15:19
Quote Posted by charpe6
For some reason game developers like to drag their heels when it comes to modding. I guarantee you a game like Oblivion would not have been nearly as successful if it weren't for all the mods that came out that allowed you to change the mistakes of the developers into something fun. It baffles me why more developers don't follow Id and Bethesda's examples when it comes to moddable games.
It's not entirely the fault of the developer. They need to have the funding to develop the modding tools...if they don't, then their job is no more than to develop the game.
van HellSing on 1/6/2009 at 15:22
You know, for a community who plays Thief, Deus Ex and the like, there sure is a lot of linear thinking here.
According to some, there seem to be only three possible states when it comes to asessing game development:
1 I HATE EVERYTHING! :mad:
2 I LOVE EVERYTHING! :D
3 Opinion? Bah, we have to wait until we see the full game.
I'm currently being shoved into category 1.
Just a few months ago I was being shoved into 2 in the Deus Ex boards ("I suspect van HellSing has been hired by Eidos as a propaganda manager :eww:" - d'Spair), now it's 1 also since I expressed discontent at the game not being shown at E3 two years into production. :rolleyes:
rainynight65 on 1/6/2009 at 15:27
Quote Posted by New Horizon
Well, I think the disappointment of TDS helped people make up their minds a little faster this time. Commercialism has a way of making a cynic out of just about anyone. It's not as if 'you' know it's going to be a good game either...so, you know...I'm sure if it does rank up there with the quality of T1/2 that people will change their minds. Sorry man, but Ion Storm really did a great job burning the community for any future installments. Cut them some slack. You don't seem to realize that small details like a logo can sometimes go a long way in showing that a development studio really has their finger on the pulse of the fan base. From EM's reaction to the fans on the logo, they really don't seem to.
I enjoyed T1, I loved T2 and I didn't think T3 was a disappointment at all. Despite the shortcomings of the game I personally think Ion Storm were on the right track. And I am sorry to say so, but narrow minds don't get any slack from me. And someone who makes up their mind seeing a logo that has nothing but draft status is narrow-minded, no offense. Basically they are coming here and saying 'Thief 4 will be shit', not in that many words though. It's the kind of destructive negativity that would make me sick if I had to dwell on the thought for an extended amount of time.
I think what this community needs to do is cut the developers some slack. Hang in there, play TDP, TMA and all the fan missions you can get hold of, and when the game comes out, we can all form our own opinion. If it is crap, we will know soon enough. But don't pretend to know what you can't know by any reasonable logic.
rainynight65 on 1/6/2009 at 15:36
Quote Posted by van HellSing
You know, for a community who plays Thief, Deus Ex and the like, there sure is a lot of linear thinking here.
Look who's talking!
Sorry, I could not resist that one. Thanks for the opening.
Quote Posted by van HellSing
According to some, there seem to be only three possible states when it comes to asessing game development:
1 I HATE EVERYTHING! :mad:
2 I LOVE EVERYTHING! :D
3 Opinion? Bah, we have to wait until we see the full game.
Hmm. You certainly seem to fall into the first category as far as Thief is concerned. The negativity in your posts is exemplary, and I personally find it very destructive, as stated previously. But I didn't see anyone put up these categories. I do see a lot of linear thinking and a lot of narrow-mindedness. Myself, I certainly have my opinions, but I refuse to cement them in at this point in time. I watch and wait. What you are doing is basically not allowing yourself to have at least a little bit of optimism. I have learned that if you always expect the worst, that's exactly what you get.
Brian The Dog on 1/6/2009 at 15:43
Quote Posted by van HellSing
According to some, there seem to be only three possible states when it comes to asessing game development:
1 I HATE EVERYTHING! :mad:
2 I LOVE EVERYTHING! :D
3 Opinion? Bah, we have to wait until we see the full game.
Three options is waaaaay more than a lot of game developers give :ebil:
Quote Posted by Springheel
Also, the amateurs have the advantage of not having to worry about budgets, deadlines, and commercial success. We're designing TDM to appeal to a very specific audience: fans of T1/2. I suspect EM's goal for T4 is something different, so I don't know that we can judge both by the same standard of success.
This is very true. If you're a games publisher who have shareholders to be responsible to, your concept of success will be very different to a fan-based consortium. My friend was talking to a fellow graduate from my uni who went into games programming, and the last 3 games he worked on sank without much of a trace. The game company survives since they made some franchise games (I think they were something to do with Batman and the Simpsons). I don't mean to put words into their mouths, but even the Thief fans working on the Dark Mod would produce something different to the real end product if they had a limited deadline etc. Which is why I'm VERY glad they don't :)
Edit - I was reminded of Guillermo del Toro, who famously produces alternating movies between those to sell well, and those he makes to please his cinematic aesthetic. Maybe game developers could do this? Or is there not enough slack in the system to allow?
