skacky on 4/4/2013 at 05:27
The latest Tomb Raider game barely sold enough copies, and Thief is a niche game with most of its fans pissing on Eidos Montreal. I think there's no chance it will meet sale numbers, and trust me I know what I mean when I talk of niche games. Besides most of the profane folks think it's a bad ripoff of Dishonored.
Azaran on 4/4/2013 at 05:29
Quote Posted by jtr7
As long as EM doesn't profit from your legal acquisition of the title, go for it!
That's what I'm thinking, I want to find a way to have it without them profiting. I don't want to do the unthinkable, but worst case scenario....:erm:
MasterTaffer on 4/4/2013 at 05:57
I'm starting to get the feeling that Edios Montreal is just trolling us, it's almost as if like they WANT for a pitchfork and torch-wielding angry mob to storm their building.
Captain Spandex on 4/4/2013 at 06:12
Quote Posted by skacky
The latest Tomb Raider game barely sold enough copies, and Thief is a niche game with most of its fans pissing on Eidos Montreal. I think there's no chance it will meet sale numbers...
Less than none.
It's a launch title exclusive for next-gen systems and NASA supercomputers that won't even have large enough built-in user bases for Eidos Montréal to make their money back, let alone profit... even if
everything goes right with the launch of these systems. (Hint: It never does) The systems are barely launching four months before the game is supposed to launch! Even if they wait an extra year, it's just not happening.
There is literally
no way you can slice it where EM makes their money back on ThiefBoot.
Renzatic on 4/4/2013 at 06:20
I'm gonna say one thing before I ask one of the moderators to ban me from this subboard, so I'm not ever tempted to waste my time down here again. BOOZE TALKING PLEEZE IGNORE!
I came down here to talk about a new Thief game. I didn't expect everything to be sunshine and roses, because a new game coming out nearly a decade later is bound to be a little different, and some people are bound to be a little put off by these differences. It happens.
But I expected things to at least be a little reasonable.
Over the last couple of days, I've come to realize what this board is. It's not an anticipation forum. There's nothing to anticipate. It's a witch hunt. Plain and simple. Most of you here don't want a new Thief. You don't want a new game to enjoy. You want to find a reason to hate the people who had the audacity to think they could make a better Thief game.
Now I know what you're all going to say next. "That's not true. We want to like it. We really do". No you don't. You're lying. Wanna know how I know? Because some of you here are actually taking personal offense to a goddamn making of video. OHHHH THE ARROGANCE! LOOK AT THEM SMIRK AT US! THEY DON'T GET WHAT THIEF IS! THEY'RE SELLING US OUT TO THE MASSES! As if to say you know what's better than they do, and it irks you to the core when they say something contrary to what you believe to be the one right way to do things. There's no such thing as a contrary opinion. It's either your way, or an abject insult to the core fanbase you all represent.
Which, by the way, is what you're not. You're all an albatross around their neck. What if they aren't trying to sell you out? What if they are, hard as it is to believe, trying to make an actual honest to god good Thief game? Yeah, I'm pretty sure they love hearing about how stupid they are, and how you all make them sick, and how they shouldn't even try making a new game because it's a complete waste of time on their part.
Some fanbase you all are, huh? If I were a developer and had to deal with you people, I'd rather take a bullet to my chest. At least then I'd die thinking I was doing something worthwhile, and keep my self esteem. Not "Oh hey, I get to make a new Thief game? I like Thief! Cool! Oh wait. No. I'm a piece of shit for trying".
The honest brutal truth of the matter is what we're all looking at right now, you, I, everyone here, is the death of Thiefgen. What this place is going to become over the next few months is the shore of all the Eidos ban washups. You're all angry. They're ruining your game. You saw that one trailer. IT'S TERRIBLE! All the negative opinions are gonna grow into one big mass seething frenzy of negativity feeding so voraciously off itself that none of you will be able to look at anything objectively.
Then Thief will come out...
And it'll either be great, terrible or merely alright...
And you'll all just kinda drift away. All the good of this once thriving community likely ending up getting lost in the big self pity circle jerk this place is soon to become. A few will linger. Most will probably head elsewhere.
Each time one of you screams about "the masses". About being sold out. About how they don't care about you (and honestly, why should they). About how they don't understand what you want or what Thief is. It's a death knell. A hammer slammed against the top of the coffin as another nail gets driven in.
It doesn't have to be this way, of course. All it'd take is a little less negativity, a little more of an open mind. But the way things are going now, I kinda doubt it's gonna happen.
Now keep in mind I don't have any problem with any of you here. I think the way you're all handling yourself is about damn shameful, but I don't really hate anyone, regardless of my opinion of your opinions.
What I really think is you've all forgotten how to have fun, and you're all taking this far, far, far too personally and seriously.
Oh well. It's a crying shame. See you all in Gen Gaming! o/
TheDorkProject on 4/4/2013 at 06:21
Much as I really, really, really disapprove of them not using Stephen Russell, I cannot bring myself to be hoping for the game to fail financially.
I'm still glad another Thief game is being made, and I still hope more games in the series continue to be made into the future. Perhaps for Thief 5 whoever makes it, whether it be Eidos Montreal or someone else, will use Russell again.
Even if Russell never plays Garrett again, which would make me very sad indeed... I don't want this title to fall on it's face financially.
The fact is, Eidos Montreal DID do a good job on Deus Ex, it was far from perfect... but they showed a respect for the original game IMO. At least, more than I expected these days...
and from what I'm seeing of Thief 4, yes there's much to be frustrated about, glowing interactable objects... parkour nonsense... etc, BUT there is also a lot of coolness there too. It's probably going to be like Deadly Shadows. You have to squeeze it to get some coolness out of it, but it's not entirely devoid of it.
Perhaps this is just our lot in life as old school fans, to be disappointed, eternally. Like the Star Wars prequels... Invisible War... Deadly Shadows... you name it.
If only Looking Glass had survived into the kickstarter era.
TheDorkProject on 4/4/2013 at 06:28
Quote Posted by Renzatic
I'm gonna say one thing before I ask one of the moderators to ban me from this subboard, so I'm not ever tempted to waste my time down here again.
You made some good points in that post, but there was also an excessive amount of drama and finger pointing. People love the voice work Russell did for Garrett, and he's iconic to this community now as that character. The news that he isn't appearing in the new game JUST broke, literally within what, the last couple days at most? You honestly didn't expect at least a few days of adjustment and anger to that news?
And you can't use your own self-restraint and willpower to not visit, or visit less... forums you don't like? You have to request to be banned?
I agree with you that some of the comments about this are over the top. And I'm *firmly* in the "disappointed it's not Stephen Russell" camp - but I think you're being just as over the top, and just as childish... let people vent.
As though your "sky is falling" nonsense about the community ending, and drying up into a shriveled husk of smoldering hatred toxic to all who stumble upon it... is somehow better than other peoples' "sky is falling" about Russell not being allowed to reprise the role.
Renzatic on 4/4/2013 at 06:38
Quote Posted by TheDorkProject
You made some good points in that post, but there was also an excessive amount of drama and finger pointing. People love the voice work Russell did for Garrett, and he's iconic to this community now as that character. The news that he isn't appearing in the new game JUST broke, literally within what, the last couple days at most? You honestly didn't expect at least a few days of adjustment and anger to that news?
And you can't use your own self-restraint and willpower to not visit, or visit less... forums you don't like? You have to request to be banned?
Yeah...well. There's a lot of hyperbole on my part, but I'm just so damn exasperated at the unreasonableness of it all. There's disappointment, and there's frothing at the mouth negativity. We're seeing more of the latter around here. It's even worse than what I remember during the Thief 3 days.
It's getting ridiculous.
Quote:
I agree with you that some of the comments about this are over the top. And I'm *firmly* in the "disappointed it's not Stephen Russell" camp - but I think you're being just as over the top, and just as childish... let people vent.
Probably. I'm likely venting just as much. Gotta have my moment too, I guess.
Quote:
As though your "sky is falling" nonsense about the community ending, and drying up into a shriveled husk of smoldering hatred toxic to all who stumble upon it... is somehow better than other peoples' "sky is falling" about Russell not being allowed to reprise the role.
Now this? This is very much a possibility. Want an example? Look at the old Fallout community. It's a mirror image of what this place is soon to become if it ends up collapsing in on itself. It's so bad, you can practically quote some lines verbatim from some random poster over at NMA to some random poster here now.
If things get too unreasonably angry around here, it'll chase away good future members (and right now you've all got a prime chance of reinvigorating the subforums here), and draw in all the bad ones. The bad ones don't ever stick around for long. They'll bitch, white, moan, and groan for awhile, then scoot on over to some other random forum where they can display their persecution complex for a whole bunch of new people to see and feed off of.
The good future forum members? They could love New Thief, could end up coming here to check out the older games, see the FMs, maybe make a few themselves. But since everyone here is currently flagellating themselves and talking about how much they hope EM dies in a financial hellfire, they'll probably bolt away the moment they see the crazy on display.
Not everyone is a "true fan" you know. Not by some definitions anyway. But be a little less extreme, a little more positive, and they could be.
Renault on 4/4/2013 at 06:44
Quote Posted by Captain Spandex
It's a launch title exclusive for next-gen systems
I know it's for next gen/PS4/Xbox 720 etc, but have they actually stated that it's a
launch title? I don't think it's an exclusive any kind either.
@Renz - I get what you're saying, there's a lot of negativity going around today. But I think there's only a small handful of folks here in the "witch hunt" category, and it's pretty obvious who they are. I think the rest of the pack here is somewhere else in the spectrum between pessimism and optimism. My only words of caution are, don't be too quick to pass judgement on the day EM announces Stephen Russell won't be playing Garrett. That's the sacred cow to Thief fans, and a dealbreaker for some. I think before that particular piece of news came out, most people were a lot more open minded and actually giving EM the benefit of the doubt and saying some positive things. And once this SR things dies down a bit, people will get to that way again. At least a little.
For myself, NewThief is a no questions asked purchase for me once it's released, so I don't need to be convinced of anything. I'm too invested in the franchise to pass on it. Others here will need convincing, and that's on EM to say and do the right things.
TheDorkProject on 4/4/2013 at 06:44
Quote Posted by Renzatic
Yeah...well. There's a lot of hyperbole on my part, but I'm just so damn exasperated at the unreasonableness of it all.
Well I agree people should be more open-minded.
I want to give Thief 4 a chance, I think it could have a lot going for it. I'm glad it's being made.
I think people would've been more able to overlook all the other changes, if they'd kept Russell.
As much as not having Russell bothers me, it is not a total and complete "deal breaker" for me. After all, if I got in a time machine and was taken 500 years into the future, and there was a craze for making sequels to games from the present, but the sensibilities of that time were wildly different... and they decided to make Thief 5, I'd be excited to play it and enjoy whatever similarities it had, even though it clearly wouldn't have Russell.
So, I'll be giving Thief 4 a chance. I am looking forward to it. Just disappointed about lack of Russell.
But I hear you re: NMA etc, I looooooved Fallout 1. I understood peoples' trepidation about it going 3D, but my feelings were the same then. I thought we were lucky to be getting a Fallout 3 at all, and I really ended up loving Fallout 3 too.
So yes, people can be too picky and too negative. I agree with you on that. At the same time? I understand people having a threshold where, if the new title goes too far... they just throw their hands up in disgust. I understand why they feel that way.
You and I are lucky that our threshold is perhaps calibrated a bit more realistically... let's be grateful for that and sympathetic to the others.
