Thief's Gameplay has become too boring/easy/predictable

Ghost on 20/6/2010 at 15:57

Quote Posted by d'Spair

yeah, but if you suddenly fall off a ladder three hours into the game due to the engine bug...

i didnt say it was the best idea ever LOL

I do save occasionally but not before every risky part, just enough so i dont have to keep replaying the same section 18 times.

Lytha on 20/6/2010 at 22:19

I took more or less a break from the first two Thief games at some point in between 2001-2003 or something like that. Some years after TDS was released, I bought and played that, but that was the only taffing I did in all these years.

Last winter I reinstalled Thief Gold and TDS (my T2 CD is broken thanks to moving to another town, so I didn't reinstall that... I also don't connect T2 with enough positive memories to be bothered to try and get a new copy of the game; in fact, I blame T2 as the reason for why I stopped playing the Thief games). And then I struggled with how to get TG running on a multicore computer, and got playing.

First scary observation: I still moved through some missions like I did back then. Yeah, I missed some loot on that path and had to backtrack, but the paths seemed to be hardcoded somewhere in my cerebellum.

Second even scarier observation: For several missions, I still did know the loot totals, within a certain margin at least.

Third nice observation: While I still could play the game quite well, it was fun again.

So yeah. Take a break if it bores the hell out of you. If you return some years later, it might be fun again. :)

Contrary to you, Ghost, I like to save a lot, but I never really reload unless it's really screwed up completely or I fall and die from ladders. The F11 button gives me a warm and safe feeling and thus enables me to do those low gravitation physics-enabled long jumps without falling down.

Chade on 20/6/2010 at 23:34

Quote Posted by Lytha

First scary observation: I still moved through some missions like I did back then. Yeah, I missed some loot on that path and had to backtrack, but the paths seemed to be hardcoded somewhere in my cerebellum.

I had that, too. :erg:

I want my brain back!

scottyd on 23/6/2010 at 02:16

Quote Posted by Poetic thief

Now before you rip my throat out, Hold ON !!!!!

Don't get me wrong. I still love Thief 1 and 2 (both official games and fan missions).

The things I love are:

story

setting

atmosphere (still original and immersive after all these years)

ambience

sound

cutscenes and artwork

heck, I love the graphics which have aged well in my opinion because of the iconic Thief design

However, while I still love those aspects of the game, actually playing the game is just not as much fun as it once was :(

I pretty much know how to avoid guards, how to get right up behind them to blackjack, how to push my luck and get away with it etc.

It seems as if the only way to enjoy the gameplay is if I use self-imposed gameplay limitations, like not using water arrows, or health potions.

So to the Thief veterans here, do you still enjoy the gameplay as much as when you were a newbie? What do you do to keep it fun ?

Are there any fan missions which are known for particularly challenging gameplay (but still have good story, atmosphere etc) ?

Try playing DID... I mean when you start a mission or game, don't save, load, save load... etc..
play like it is real life.. you die... "YOU DIE!" try to ghost it like that.. most people save load, reload, reaload a billion times to ghost a mission.. a baby can do that.... try a challenge..

1st.. dead is dead... when you die start over...

along with DID, use no potions or water arrows.

if thats not enough, do not use lean forward frontal knock outs, door knock outs

or no knock outs

play it like real life... dead is dead, no water arrows (only when mission requires), health potions, and a small blackjack isn't going to ko no guard with even a leather helm on..

I play dead is dead all the time... a GREAT challenge, even using potions, water arrows and ko's..

good luck

Koki on 23/6/2010 at 06:58

Quote Posted by Kaleid

What really would spice up thief is new alternative AI... probably very difficult to achieve but it's mostly with the AI that the predictability occurs.

Some AIs already present in the game are better than others. Compare normal guards with Ramirez's assassins for example. All you'd need to do is swap some values I believe... but modding actual Thief seems to be taboo here :rolleyes:

Kaleid on 23/6/2010 at 13:34

Quote Posted by Koki

Yeah, I did notice that.
And I replayed Thief Gold and Metal Age with the ultimate difficulty mods a couple of days ago, but a lot of the time it was way way too hard... So I'd like to see something inbetween vanilla and the ultimate difficulty mod.

AI modding shouldn't be taboo. The vanilla one is too easy and predictable. :(

Brian T on 23/6/2010 at 17:20

Quote Posted by Kaleid

So I'd like to see something inbetween vanilla and the ultimate difficulty mod.(

Yeah, I actually PMed the guy who did this mod some years ago if he could do a scalable difficulty factor, like a moveable slider or something but he didn't seem to know how to do it, or was unwilling.

*Zaccheus* on 26/6/2010 at 21:02

Quote Posted by Poetic thief

Now before you rip my throat out, Hold ON !!!!!

LOL

Quote Posted by Poetic thief

So to the Thief veterans here, do you still enjoy the gameplay as much as when you were a newbie? What do you do to keep it fun ?

I don't actually play anymore, due to some rather (http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=132421) unpleasent deveplopments, but I agree that there is very little left in the way of challenge if you get to know a game engine as well as some of us do.

I once got accused of arrogance because I said that I play Thief for relaxation. Like all veterans I know exactly how to just move through a mission and take out the guards. After a stressful day at work it can be a nice way to unwind.

Each fan mission has its own set of challeges though, with puzzles etc. so there are still some hair raising moments.

Mortal Monkey on 29/6/2010 at 23:46

I think one of the main problems is getting stuck in a certain play style. There's often a lot more you can get from a game if you play it radically differently, especially in open-ended games like Thief and Deus Ex.

Having done a lot of ghosting and qucksaving in Thief 2, I found it very refreshing to play through Thief 1 without allowing myself to save ((http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95008) shameless plug). The challenge of never being seen was a lot different from the challenge of escaping with your life after screwing up.

After seeing some inspiring videos, I think Crack Monkey style will be next on the agenda.

Koki on 30/6/2010 at 06:06

But how you will achieve a crack monkey style in a game you know in and out?

Try playing it drunk and record it.