Albert on 19/6/2010 at 04:36
I stopped watching this video series. It made me cringe in ways I didn't think possible.
My first time playing, I near about had a heart attack leaning over the corner when I first got into Bafford's manor, and one of the guards blurted out the now-familiar "Stop right there!" voice and I just about flung the mouse off the desk. Later that day, I knew better.
This guy... He made me wanna cry when he simply just threw a mine at the guards, and how simply careless he was, after that.
Vernon on 19/6/2010 at 04:51
Quote Posted by Pester
So, uh, I was active here in 2004-2005, though I'm sure no one remembers me, and swing through to read threads once a year or so since, but now I'm a goon and mentioned this thread in the something awful one, which is why the man himself showed up. Hope I didn't ruin the fun.
Look at what you have done.
<Username> on 19/6/2010 at 09:37
Khad's new video is up. Some comments:
03:30 Just do a quicksave before you rope down into the cave. This is the fifth time you died there, reloaded and then had to go all the way back to the rope.
05:14 That climb is poorly designed. I hate falling off the plank too.
06:13 In Thief Gold they implemented the Fire Shadow enemy as a way to get more fire arrows, but you haven't found the right place yet.
10:47 Looks like you finally learn when to do a quicksave.
11:57 Why do you fail at basic math?
16:06 Yep, water arrows harm the Fire Shadow.
16:43 See? He drops fire arrows.
17:22 Yes, quicksave! Good thinking!
20:37 Forgot about quicksaving... again.
25:13 I agree, that ladder is a deathtrap. It's funny looking at this footage and then reading the design document of the game describe "good ladder experience".
26:43 Garrett is not grabbing it because you are too close to the ceiling. There is no room for him to mantle up.
Congratulations on beating Bonehoard, the mission that made me want to give up on the game when I first played it. I think you will like the upcoming mission Assassins a bit more.
Azaran on 19/6/2010 at 09:52
Last part of the Bonehoard was good. Aside from all the redundant - especially falling - deaths, it was pretty good. He even solved the golden bone puzzle. He's getting the hang of it.
Koki on 19/6/2010 at 11:49
Quote Posted by <Username>
Khad's new video is up. Some comments:
You can add comments to Viddler videos if you're registered.
And yeah, good job figuring out the golden bone puzzle. He'd be a pretty good player if it wasn't for the ADD.
Lytha on 19/6/2010 at 12:54
Quote Posted by Koki
He'd be a pretty good player if it wasn't for the ADD.
Now, don't you dare to blame his brother's cat for all the fail. :p
jermi on 19/6/2010 at 15:53
Quote Posted by Khad on SA
I always like how the really crazy and rabid fans of some really old game get pissed when it is remade to be more "user friendly" and in effect, more fun.
What delicious irony that you should use quotation marks there. Thief Deadly Shadows will teach you a few new meanings for the word "clunky", if you ever get that far. I hope you do.
Bonehoard death reel was absolutely hilarious.
RailGun15 on 19/6/2010 at 18:21
Since i don't have an account in the something awful forums i do hope you read this khad (or someone quote this post to the thread)
Quote:
Same thing applies in this situation. I am not denying that in its time, Thief was probably a great game (I was busy playing Diablo 2, Starcraft, and Everquest in 1999 so I can't personally say if I had that opinion). However, to the standards of games today (which is not a bad standard) I can say that it doesn't quite live up to the test of time. Lets face it, it is clunky, the controls aren't all that great, you aren't given any real direction, and it leads to a frustrating gaming experience. Honestly, would the same game released today (given better, current generation graphics obviously) be as acclaimed as it was? I don't believe so and the only reason I bring it up is because of the annoyingly loyal folks that cry up and down that the sequels are apparently awful because they made it "noob friendly". God forbid a developer to create sequels that address problems with the original and bring in a larger client base by actually appealing to people outside of the realm of masochism!
It took me quite a while to understand what made the thief games so great for me and why i keep playing it after all this years. Thief is a stealth game with a heavy focus on exploration, that means that the game encourages and sometimes forces you (with maps like bonehoard) to slowly explore every inch of the map. Since there are no waypoints and few linear paths to follow, the player himself has to find his own way thought the large non-linear levels to complete the objectives with little help from the game itself. This is why what you call frustation i call it inmersion, you are supposed to get lost in the burrick tunnels, underground tombs, etc and struggle to finish the map. However is important to mention that not everyone in the thief fan base likes this type of gameplay, some prefer the more direct stealth elements (breaking into buildings and steal stuff) which is fine but that is only a half of what thief is about
Now the fact that you don't like this gameplay style (as with most modern gamers) doesn't mean that the game is bad, its just the reason why we are die hard fans of a game that was released 11 years ago: there has been no game that has managed to replicate the thief formula, other stealth games leave the exploration aspect out.
Now to the matter of other stealth games
Quote:
To digress onto another game series, I think that some people are a little unfair to Conviction in the sense that it doesn't have the "stealth elements" of earlier games in the series. Don't get me wrong, I have played and loved all the games in the Splinter Cell series, however Conviction remains at the top for me. The story of Conviction won me over and the game play was changed to a more "I am pissed, time to kill poo poo" rather than "hey lets be quiet and not get seen" not to appeal to "consoletards" or whatever in my opinion. The game play meshes well with the storyline. Before you were an NSA operative out to do missions and not be caught. Now you are a rogue agent who has the "fifth freedom" to go about killing who you please in the name of revenge and answers. Think of it like one of those movies where the protagonist is boned at the start of the movie and slowly kills his way to the top of the chain of command in order to get revenge.
Its very nice of you to mention Splinter Cell: Conviction since i believe that the game is taking the stealth gameplay in the wrong direction. The first two splinter cells and the hitman games adapt the direct stealth elements of the thief series very well (but like i said before, with less exploration). What makes this games great however is the emphasis on choice. For example you can kill a guard, knock him out or avoiding altogether and you have more than one path to complete the objetives.
Now with a game like Conviction (and most modern FPS) there is only one way to finish the game, his way, and the player is forced to walk in a linear path in which the player has no other choice but to play like the game wants you too (in this case, kill everyone). Also the game is way too easy, with the dumb AI and the mark and execute skill is like "the game does everything for you" (quoting Yahtzee, a video game reviewer). There is one part of that game that really shows this: when Sam finds he was betrayed by everyone and goes into rage mode, the game marks the enemies automatically and i only have to press fire to kill.¿I'm not good enough to kill the bad guys by myself?
I hope that with this you understand why i, a thief fan, like a game so old with clunkly controls and terrible acrobatics (not so bad once you get the hang of it)
SneakyJack on 19/6/2010 at 19:07
Some of the generous comments being left on SA about this thread and community:
Quote Posted by "Pester"
Actually, a small but devoted remnant of Thief superfans are still active at the original Through The Looking Glass forums, and there's a thread for following this LP.
Quote Posted by "DeFluxx"
Geez Khad, improve your profanity vocabulary already won't you? You're losing viewers!
Edit: Some people on there really aren't big fans of how Khad is treating their favourite game are they?
I think you should stay away from the ttlg forums Khad. You're not welcome there.
Quote Posted by "Geop"
Just read the thread. Christ, these people are assholes. I'm not trying to white knight Khad, but that sorta stuff is just silly. They're kinda missing the point of this LP.
Quote Posted by "tranceMD"
Haha the people in that thread are in every way worse than the few "lol u sux" people here. Apparently Khad "sucks dragonballs" and is a "consoletard". And the first game he ever played was Halo, which I guess is pretty damning in some way, maybe. And yet they continue to watch! Khad may have the most hypocritical audience following in the history of lp.
The railing against people on SA is also fun, especially the guy who talks about the videos being made to be watched by a bunch of nerds, then talks about his experience watching all of the videos.
edit: Man what is it about Thief that makes people rag on someone when they don't think he's "doing it right". This is especially lame when the said someone is producing highly entertaining content.
Quote Posted by "Edminster"
Goddamn some of those ttlg people are retarded douchenozzles. Seriously, they're calling Khad stupid when a couple of them were trying to use the thread rating system for page navigation here. There's enough :smug: in that thread to choke a burrick.
Quote Posted by "Conskill"
They're hardcore fans of a dev studio that failed a decade ago, squirreled away in their own isolated Internet community. I loved LGS as much as the next nerd, but that kind of fandom does strange things to a man.
Quote Posted by "Alain Perdrix"
I have had an account on TTLG for the better part of a decade, though I post very rarely. That forum was what got me into ghosting these games.
It's sort of embarrassing to see how sad and humourless they can be - and that just refers to the ones that "get it." For every one of them that does, it seems like there's another that is genuinely confused as to what is happening / cannot grasp the concept behind this "let's play."
Quote Posted by "Khad"
I bet the guys over at the TTG forums were so pissed when that was changed. How dare they fix their level so that people who don't already know how to beat it can actually progress through it! :argh:
At this point I don't know who is trolling who, but this whole thing is silly :laff:
I have to agree about the smugness, super seriousness and lack of humor though. Sometimes TTLG can be really, really stuffy and closed minded about things. That doesn't take away from the fact that the person doing this Thief Let's Play is playing Thief like a first person shooter, though.
