Welly well well... guess who comes crawling back? - by lost_soul
ZylonBane on 9/3/2011 at 19:48
I'm a non-console-owning reasonably dedicated PC gamer, and even I consider the current long console hardware cycle to be a good thing. The more elaborate game graphics are, the more expensive they are to create, the less risks game makers take, and thus gaming as a whole suffers.
lost_soul on 9/3/2011 at 19:53
You've got a valid point. The game needs to be fun first and foremost. Some of us would still love to see what the modern PC hardware can really do though. I remember seeing Unreal on a Voodoo2 and there was just no way any console could come remotely close to that at the time.
Renzatic on 9/3/2011 at 20:20
Graphic technology has gotten to the point where I barely care about the march forward anymore. I'd rather developers put what we've got to good use, or break down engines so they do the same thing more efficiently.
I mean what's left by this point? All big name engines can handle as many polys as you can throw at them these days. They can handle multi stage 4096x textures, which is more than enough resolution to do just about anything you'd ever want. All that's really left is lighting. If you take current tech polycount and texture res, mix it with high fidelity lighting, and you'd get photorealistic results.
Now don't get me wrong here. I still think there's tons of room for improvement. But the improvements we're working towards are more subtle than they used to be. Just compare Unreal Engine 3 with the new shots and videos Epic is showing of UE4. The differences are there, the details a bit more refine, but it's not a huge jump like it was from Unreal Engine 1, to 2, to 3. Same thing goes for just about any other new engine coming out these days.
I'd rather see developers follow Id's lead, and don't worry about the latest and greatest effects so much, but rather concentrate techniques that allow for more artistic freedom while being far more efficient with your hardware resources.
demagogue on 9/3/2011 at 20:35
I agree. Where we are right now is very good to make some very atmospheric games.
That Battlefield 3 video in Iraq had such great atmosphere and visuals... But then when you pick up that body you get a ridiculous "Back" button flashing on the bottom, like you need to be told to get out of the line of fire when you're being shot at, and suddenly there's this staged ambush around you in the middle of a parking lot, and it falls back on to these retarded tropes that apparently most gamers can't imagine their way out of. It just spoiled it for me. All this great atmosphere and build up, then they have to piss in the punch. (They should have no excuse. I saw Black Hawk Down again a few days ago and it's a very well choreographed war movie. That's how you stage street battles.)
On a more positive spin, that Crysis 2 video made me love the idea of building on that editor. How much fun to drop a near photorealistic world down in as much detail as you like and walk around in it right off, with full lighting and effects.
june gloom on 9/3/2011 at 20:55
lost_soul, you know that list of things you need to stop saying? Add "any sentence that begins with 'I remember'" to that list. You always sound so stuck in the past and completely out of touch.
Anyway, how is this at all surprising, or even worthy of elitist gloating? PC gaming has always moved ahead in terms of graphical fidelity at the end of a console generation. Then the next stack of consoles come out and take the lead again. That's just how the cycle goes. No need for gloating. It really shouldn't have to be a fucking competition between consoles and PCs, and terrible comments like lost_soul's only perpetuate the problem. At this point the platform elitism is getting stupid enough that (
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2001/02/12/) I'm just waiting for the dumbass to cut the shithead. Whatever happened to just playing the goddamn game?
Ahem. Tangent.
Anyway, part of the reason the current cycle has gone on so long is because we've sort of reached a plateau, a point of diminishing returns. Even five years ago we were seeing big leaps and bounds every so often as developers found new techniques, but that's slowed down considerably. As Renz said, the changes are more subtle now.
henke on 9/3/2011 at 21:41
^^^what dethtoll said.
"guess who comes crawling back"
Jesus. Developers are targeting the PC because at the moment it's more powerful than consoles and the only place you can really push the boundaries. But in lost_soul's worldview this translates into developers coming crawling back on their knees, pleading "we're sorry, PC gamers, please take us back! Save us!" ...and then lost_soul will look down, and he'll whisper "No."
Thirith on 9/3/2011 at 21:49
Nice one, henke. :D
"I'm not Bobby Kotick. Do you seriously think I'd explain my master-stroke to PC gamers if there remained the slightest chance of them affecting its outcome? I ported it thirty-five minutes ago."
lost_soul on 9/3/2011 at 21:51
Faster GPUs don't automatically mean better looking games either. A lot of what makes a game look great is in the artwork, not just the polycount. For example, check out the sky on Nyleve's Falls (Unreal), or the textures in Thief 1.
Jason Moyer on 9/3/2011 at 21:57
I think the reason we're at a plateau has little to nothing to do with technology, and everything to do with consumerism. The next generation of consoles will arrive when the 360/Wii/PS3 have reached their limit in terms of profitability and it makes financial sense for something new to come out.
