jtr7 on 18/11/2009 at 01:53
It follows the Mechanists' number one tenet to a tee. Karras's plan is sound, nothing is out of place, it's just hard to wrap the head around wishing the total eradication of organic life, to replace it with "perfect" machines. To do away with the cursed flesh for a new perfect body, free from pain, etc., is a common religious idea--the Mechanists include the plant life, beloved of the Pagans. Karras's only contradiction is placing himself as equal or above The Builder.
kamyk on 18/11/2009 at 02:02
Translation of sentence structure based upon punctuation useage.
Quote:
"The day shall come when I, too, breathe in His perfection."
"The day shall come when I, also, inhale his perfection." That is quite simply how the punctuation marks define the sentence in the english language.
To be translated into the context in question. "The day shall come when I, also, breathe in his presence" would require a punctuation of:
"The day shall come when I too, breathe, in his perfection." (And incidentally, would also indicate someone else other than Karrass was breathing in the Builder's presence.)
That isn't the punctuation that was used, therefore it is the incorrect interpretation. That's just plain how the english punctuation stands. Arguing interpretations won't change the punctuation that was used in game, nor what it represents in english.
(
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/breathe+in)
Namdrol on 18/11/2009 at 07:19
Thanks Kamyak, it's what I was starting to say before I got lost up my own arse.
;)
massimilianogoi on 19/11/2009 at 00:50
Sorry guys, but no one could tell that he would have erase himself just after having destroy everyone.
Here's the complete sentence: "Alas, I alone must wait for purification. I must remain alive to greet The Builder, while all around me all else is cleansed by His wondrous breath. The day shall come when I, too, breathe in His perfection. My burden is heaviest now, but my rewards will be greatest...later. " As we can see, he didn't tell "breathe in His perfection, just after his Paradise wilt be arrived", but "The day shall come when I, too, breathe in His perfection."; THAT day is unknown. He may not referring to the immediate moment after the NM has killed any other organic forms.
kamyk on 19/11/2009 at 02:18
That can be conceded. No one was arguing when he planned to subject himself to the Necrotoxin, only that he said he would.
Whether or not he actually would have, or when he would have done so is (as far as I am aware) completely open to speculation.
Goldmoon Dawn on 19/11/2009 at 02:58
:eek:
Quote Posted by Goldmoon Dawn
Seriously? Because the degree of detail that you are reaching for on the specific subject just doesnt freakin' matter! jtr only noodles in on things that are relevant to identifying actual canon. The only thing that your theory would best fit is your own fascination with the Karras character. Which is cool. :ebil:
Herr_Garrett on 19/11/2009 at 07:00
Quote Posted by massimilianogoi
As we can see, he didn't tell "breathe in His perfection, just after his Paradise wilt be arrived"
That certainly can be
said, since it's ungrammatical.
You see, the problem is, you insist on Karras's having remained alive, which is utterly nonsensical. He was sealed into Soulforge. Even assuming that his own room was airtight, he
wasn't in his room when the Servants exhaled the first doses of Necrotic Mutox.
Karras might have had to wait for days, since he aimed for the destruction of all organic material, and even with the Rust Gas, that would take some days. Remember, he planned the positioning of the Servants very carefully. I'm too lazy to cite the "He draw his circles" quote. After that, he would have waited for the Builder to come - but no more than a few days, since all food is also destroyed. Thus, unless the Builder immediately manifested itself on this plane upon the completion of Karras's plan, he would either have had to inhale the Rust Gas and join everything organic in the Builder's presence, or upload his mind onto a Bot.
There's no two ways about it. Karras is dead, and a good riddance, too.
Nephthys on 19/11/2009 at 07:24
He was a pretty impressively original bad guy.
Even if he made me think of the guy from Princess Bride.
"Wuv. Troo wuv."
massimilianogoi on 19/11/2009 at 08:45
Quote Posted by Herr_Garrett
... but no more than a few days, since all food is also destroyed. Thus, unless the Builder immediately manifested itself on this plane upon the completion of Karras's plan, he would either have had to inhale the Rust Gas and join everything organic in the Builder's presence, or upload his mind onto a Bot.
As Karras would be remained intact after the reaction, so it could be the same for the food present in Soulforge: remember that this is the biggest map ever, and it's sealed, thus it could contain a mountain of food, so this food matter can't stand, Herr_Garrett.
And I repeat: we have no clues about when K would have destroyed himself, maybe he could hold on till the agedness.
Goldmoon Dawn on 19/11/2009 at 15:58
Oh yeah? And where was all this food that Karras was stockpiling? I scoured every INCH of that Mission and didnt see any food. Where was the food mass? Any amount of food meant to last longer that a week or a month would have been easy to spot. The chamber that Karras was in didnt have any food either. So, where is all this mysterious Karras survival food? LMAO And also, (using your style of argue) shouldnt Karras have said: "now that I have destroyed every living organism, the day shall come when I too breathe in his perfection, after my food supplies run out of course". blah blah blah Who wants to hear about Karras surviving for a week anyways? What kind of a story would that make?!?! He ran this ingenious plan to destroy everything, but wanted to sit around afterwords eating his gruel for a week or a month while he madly reflects on the fact that he destroyed EVERYTHING. Yeah, real cool story!
