MJohnston on 22/6/2001 at 23:13
Er... you can't say Big AND Giant Kenjo...
Wearewe on 23/6/2001 at 04:04
Oops I slipped over the keyboard .. again.. :o
Gemma on 23/6/2001 at 15:57
i believe that the helios ending is most morally correct.
The illuminati want to rule the world like a hidden god. quietly controlling people's lives. Tracer tong wants to switch off global com, he can't do that, its just stupid but it may stop techno wars, etc.
Helios wants to merge with denton, he will use denton's brain and between them they can rule without corruption or biasness (is that a word?)
Singing Dancing Moose on 23/6/2001 at 20:57
THe merging with Helios ending is best IMO simply because it's moving forward instead of backward. Both Tong and the Illuminati just wanted to return to what they thought were "the good old days". Merging with Helios was at least moving forward to a new idea of how things could be done for the benefit of everyone rather than just going back to a system that had messed up before.
Gus on 24/6/2001 at 14:21
I think it´s really cool, what Ion Storm did, coming up with three endings that aren´t RIGHT or WRONG as in many other games (Half-Life...)
Most of you seem to prefer the Helios-ending, but I have a thing about letting a computer or an AI rule the earth - I have seen far too many movies where computers go mad and starts destroying everything...
Join the Illuminati as an invisible hand next to Morgan Everett may be sweet, cuz then you get to decide a whole lot. BUT, Morgan would probably do to you as he did to that *SPOILER* *SPOILER* icy Lucius DeBeers fellow... "I COMMAND YOU" and so forth...
A new dark age would only win us some time before another secret organization rises and takes control over earth. And the pain most people would suffer in this dark age - new diseases, no order, chaos, aahh... - that´s gotta hurt.
Now, how did I do the ending? Well, since none of the endings sounded that great, I thought "heck, Tracer Tong was always helpful to me and I always could rely on him when I was scared in Hong Kong... I´ll do his ending as a favour!"
Gus - a simple man
Morte on 25/6/2001 at 12:41
Damn, this is a way cool discussion. I should´ve made my way over here earlier. :)
The choice of ending illustrates ,imo at least, perfectly what Deus Ex is about: choices (and player freedom of course). That there´s no clear 'right' or 'wrong', suits the game perfectly. There´s none of that icky moralizing, just choices and consequences. Which is rather brilliant, really.
Anyway, I went with the Tracer Tong ending, as it seemed like the least evil one. The 'compassionate conspiracy' thing didn´t really have a nice ring to it. Even if Everett was honest (to me he always seemed to be of dubious character) it could go sour all too easily. It would basically be a rewind to the times before MJ12. The Helios ending would leave an omnipotent, omniscient AI in control. Wonderful. As long as it doesn´t loose a few screws, that is. If that happened, we´d be up shit creek. Another reason it didn´t appeal to me is the fact that you´d have to merge with another being, thus loosing some of your identity, something I´d never do. Also, these two endings leaves you in charge of the world, at least to some degree, a position I have no desire to be in. Egoistical reasons, yes. Then again, I´m not that good a person. :p
So, while the Tong ending might be the initially most damaging, it seemed potentially least destructive in the long run and it leaves people in charge of their own lives instead having someone running it against their will (not to mention freeing me from the hassle of ruling the world ;)).
Did that make any sense?
kostoffj on 25/6/2001 at 15:11
Quote:
Originally posted by Morte:
<STRONG>So, while the Tong ending might be the initially most damaging, it seemed potentially least destructive in the long run and it leaves people in charge of their own lives instead having someone running it against their will (not to mention freeing me from the hassle of ruling the world ;)).
Did that make any sense?</STRONG>
Two things to consider about the Tong ending: (1) serious depopulation as global food distribution collapses; (2) it would become impossible to distribute the cure to the Gray Death (although if transportation breaks down the spread of the disease could be checked); (3) why would people be free to choose their own destiny? To my mind, the sort of government that would arise out the ensuing chaos would be brutal, petty tyranies - you know, strong shall survive and all that.
And anyway, one day the technology would be rebuilt and we'd face all these issues again. The Tong ending isn't a solution, but a postponement, IMHO.
Morte on 25/6/2001 at 18:06
(1)&(2) Yeah, that´s what I was thinking of when I said It´d be the initially most damaging. Although, as has been said earlier, the effects of destroying Echelon IV are greatly exaggerated, it wouldn´t be that difficult to get communications going again. TV & Radio transmissions, for instance, could hardly have been dependent on Echelon.
(3) I imagine it´d be a bit more difficult oppressing someone who´s familiar with the concept of democracy, and has experienced it firsthand. My point is: No conspiracies, no manipulating from behind the scenes, it´s all in the open. The majority of the people don´t like the goverment, they overthrow it and replace it with one to their liking.
Quote:
And anyway, one day the technology would be rebuilt and we'd face all these issues again. The Tong ending isn't a solution, but a postponement, IMHO.
True, but the second time around people might have learned their lesson and push the developmen in another direction to avoid getting in the same situation.
I realize this might be a bit optimistic, but I´m afraid it´s one of the vices I sometimes indulge in. :)
X on 25/6/2001 at 18:37
Surely giving our freedom to a superior being, such as Helios gives way to a greater lack of freedom. It creates a morality akin to a god. But since the being is created by humanity, it is thus flawed. This flaw will lead to a selfishness, and thus corruption. The idea of surrendering our destiny is not one that appeals to me, even as a hardline socialist.
Singing Dancing Moose on 27/6/2001 at 23:48
One thing I don't think many people thought of was the state of the world at the time of the decision you had to make. The US is still under martial law, and France is still controlled by MJ12. Destroying the communication center won't fix these problems, the occupation forces will continue as they were before. Even worse, the resulting increase in global chaos would mean that even more countries would likely fall under similarly restrictive regimes.
X, Helios' insistence that it needed to join with JC to rule correctly shows that it has the capability the perceive and correct it's own short-comings, so I see no reason to worry about it being flawed to the point of being corrupt.
