poroshin on 15/5/2009 at 12:56
Commercially, I mean. I think if done right and with a good adverting campaign (hype) it could sell well. They shouldn't be afraid to stress stealth, in fact they should challenge the players. I don't recall much, but I don't think the previous Thief games were marketed all that well. If they can generate the kind of talk there was regarding Assassin's Creed, for example, then we can have success. This can only be a good thing. Not only could it pave the way for a fifth Thief, maybe they'll re-release the older titles, too.
Yandros on 15/5/2009 at 13:36
Well let me be the first to say that, more than likely, if it sells well, it will disappoint us hardcore fans. And I don't mean we'll disappointed that it sold well, I mean we'll disappointed by what they had to do to the game to make it sell well.
It's simple: The majority of gamers don't enjoy the kind of gameplay that made T1+T2 great. If you appeal to the masses, you've probably broken, at least in part, some of the rules that made the originals so wonderful.
jay pettitt on 15/5/2009 at 13:41
They don't?
Isn't that a bit like saying if you like football you can't like tennis?
BrokenArts on 15/5/2009 at 13:45
How can we even begin to ask that question. Though, deep down I am leaning towards what Yandros said, to some degree.
jtr7 on 15/5/2009 at 13:49
No, jay. The evidence is clear after ten years. Most people don't play Thief and a hefty portion have only just heard of it or haven't. This is well-known among us, and stated with confidence. TDS is a prime example of trying to tap the other markets, and it compromised. There's not enough action, blood, killing, or shotguns, and the point is to sneak, hide in shadows, and (gasp!) wait to slip by. This is not popular at all. And Yandros wasn't saying a gamer can't like both.
mothra on 15/5/2009 at 13:54
no, I highly doubt that TLG did develop thief1+2 WITHOUT even trying to sell the game. Everybody needs to get payed and almost everybody will tell you that he wants to do a GOOD game.
What makes the difference is if you are commited to sell the game you made. I hope EM will advertise it as what it is and try to make stealth, tension, tactics, the gadgets, atmosphere and locations as interesting and amazing as possible, focus on selling what the game HAS instead of rereading the taglines for almost every FPS released up until now (bigger guns, more ammo, more enemies, less cloth on women).
Thief lends itself so good to little "mini"-heist-movies as teasers or trailers :)
I'm thinking along the lines of Neil Bokamps Halo "Docu" movies some stylized "crime-noir" heist movies could be made showcasing the Thief doing his thing.
If you sell Thief for what it is it could certainly do very well.
If you sell it as a shooter with stealth-mechanics gamers will be pissed if they find something else. If you MAKE it a shooter with stealth-mechanics:
don't call it Thief :)
poroshin on 15/5/2009 at 14:20
So do you guys really believe that pure stealth equals being doomed commercially? Again, if the hype and the advertising is done right, if the classic Thief stealth is presented right and "cool-looking" then we should be good. They shouldn't sacrifice quality for mass-appeal. They should make that quality be appealing to the masses.
SubJeff on 15/5/2009 at 14:30
Quote Posted by poroshin
They shouldn't sacrifice quality for mass-appeal. They should make that quality be appealing to the masses.
Agreed, and I think that the way to do it is to offer a wealth of options that will satisfy people who just want a pure Thief experience and those that prefer it to be a dark Assassins Creed.
jtr7 on 15/5/2009 at 14:33
Quote Posted by mothra
no, I highly doubt that TLG did develop thief1+2 WITHOUT even trying to sell the game. Everybody needs to get payed and almost everybody will tell you that he wants to do a GOOD game.
LGS made a game they didn't know if it would be received well. The widely-varied missions in TDP came from not knowing what people would like, and so they threw in something for everybody. They broke a lot of rules, intentionally, daring to prove the industry wrong, and daring players to try something different. They DID make a good game and they KNEW it, but they suspected it wouldn't be a mainstream hit...and it wasn't.
Quote Posted by poroshin
So do you guys really believe that pure stealth equals being doomed commercially? Again, if the hype and the advertising is done right, if the classic Thief stealth is presented right and "cool-looking" then we should be good. They shouldn't sacrifice quality for mass-appeal. They should make that quality be appealing to the masses.
I believe it's absolutely possible, yet highly unlikely, but hope to god they do. :D
Queue on 15/5/2009 at 14:39
Quote Posted by poroshin
So do you guys really believe that pure stealth equals being doomed commercially?
In my mind, no. But then again, I like Thief. You have to consider what the vast majority of people, right or wrong as it's what they are being fed, play then ask yourself how well a pure stealth game could be received. Then again, Thief always gave you the option to kill with glee (arrows and a sword) if one really wanted to, so I wonder just how much of a "pure stealth" game it truly was/is.
As far as making sacrifices in quality to cater to mass-appeal, I, of course, always say: Never. One should never compromise the integrity of their creation just to pander to a bunch of slack-jaws (sure they've been told McDonalds is the bees knees, but put a Fillet Mignon is front of them and...) in order to increase sales. Yet, that's just how the entertainment industry works--companies are going to produce what they think will sell because in the end they have to make money (bills have to be paid somehow; and when you have the livelihoods of a team of employees on the line, making money is the only objective).
